Aircraft Carriers II (Closed to posting)

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Jeff Head

Jeff Head

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Registered Member
Folks...this is thje model I want.


130714-O-ZZ999-417.jpg

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Hehehe. That would be nice, but it would take up the whole living room! LOL!
 
bd popeye

bd popeye

The Last Jedi
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Apparently the person that wrote this article is unaware that the Russain CV Admiral Kuznetsov was never fitted with catapults.. otherwise an interesting article. How much truth is in the article? I do not know but I've read previous article the "ADM K" was indeed in bad shape.

First off the person that wrote this article may have not know that the RU CV was designed without catapults.

Is the ship in such bad shape that she may sink? I don't know. I'd have to visit aboard. Also I'm unaware of any concern by the USN that she may sink. The USN has long shadowed Russian carriers & the Russian navy in general..

I've read other articles about the poor condition of this lone Russian CV. Nothing good about it. You cannot keep operating a ship and not properly maintain her and expect it to perform as designed.

As the Russians take delivery of their Mistral class LHD will they be able to maintain her? They'd better.



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In December 2011, the Russian navy’s aging, poorly-maintained aircraft carrier Admiral Kuznetsov departed from its northern base on the troubled vessel’s fourth deployment to the Mediterranean Sea.

True, the full-size carrier—which displaces 55,000 tons fully loaded—has a history of mechanical troubles since she entered service in 1991. But her operational tempo had increased, the result of a renewed push by Russian Pres. Vladimir Putin to get the fleet out into the oceans for training and patrols.

To that end, Admiral Kuznetsov has undergone some limited retrofits in recent years and participated in several missions to the Med, so the old vessel had done this kind of thing before.

But as the Kuznetsov rounded Europe and headed towards the Syrian coast, the U.S. Navy’s Sixth Fleet kept close by in case the carrier … sank.

It might be hard to believe, but it’s just one bizarre detail noted by journalist Michael Weiss in a recent essay on Russia’s military expansion.

Admiral Kuznetsov has a problematic history. One seaman died when the carrier caught fire during a 2009 deployment to the Med. During the same cruise, the flattop spilled hundreds of tons of fuel into the sea while refueling. Her steam turbines are so bad the ship has to be escorted by tugs in case she breaks down.

Not to mention the carrier is barely capable of doing what carriers are supposed to do: launch fighters. When she does, she uses a bow ramp instead of steam catapults, which forces reductions in the planes’ takeoff weight and patrol time.

Anyways, in 2011 despite the Americans’ concerns, Admiral Kuznetsov made it home to her home port at Severomorsk near Murmansk. But she’s headed back to the Mediterranean by year’s end—without, apparently, a long-planned retrofit to her engines and flight deck. No word from the U.S. Navy as to whether it fears the decrepit flattop again might sink.

The Kremlin’s long-term plan, according to an essay by U.S. Navy Capt. Thomas Fedyszyn in Proceedings—the monthly journal of the U.S. Naval Institute—is to establish a permanent naval task force in the region drawn from vessels assigned to the Black Sea and Northern fleets. “Russia has made sizable improvements to its fleet’s size and readiness and stepped up patrols in the region, roughly coinciding with the escalation of tensions in Syria,” he writes.

Part of this expansion includes new and retrofitted warships and an increasing number of deployments to the Mediterranean far from home bases—and outside the Russian navy’s comfort zone.

This should, in theory, result in 10 ships operating on a permanent basis out at sea—potentially including Admiral Kuznetsov. But the Russian navy has limited means to resupply ships on the open ocean. This means it needs ports.

The Russian Black Sea Fleet is based at Ukrainian ports along the Black Sea coast with the largest concentration of ships at Sevastopol. But this is a disadvantageous position, as the ports are vulnerable to political turmoil in Ukraine—the lease on Sevastopol expires in 2017, but it’s renewable.

Likewise, treaties dating to the 1930s regarding transit rights from the Black Sea through the Turkish-controlled Bosporus Straits are also a bit stifling. But the treaties limit tonnage, which is less of a concern for the kinds of modern, light and unarmored warships used today.

Otherwise, there’s the port of Tartus in Syria. But the Russian pier there has been variously described as little more than a minimally-manned and broken-down refueling spot incapable of supporting larger ships like Admiral Kuznetsov. But the port does have subjective and symbolic importance to the Kremlin.

“Unofficial rumors suggest Russia is considering ports in Cyprus, Montenegro, and Greece in addition to Syria,” Fedyszyn writes. “Of these, Cyprus has gotten the most attention, owing to the close economic relations between Moscow and Nicosia.”

In any case, Admiral Kuznetsov isn't likely to survive past the 2020s—when the Kremlin is expected to retire her. Until then, there’s little doubt the U.S. and its allies will keep a close eye, in case the aging flattop becomes a hazard to herself, her crew and anyone nearby.
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Last edited:
shen

shen

Senior Member
bd popeye said:
Apparently the person that wrote this article is unaware that the Russain CV Admiral Kuznetsov was never fitted with catapults.. otherwise an interesting article. How much truth is in the article? I do not know but I've read previous article the "ADM K" was indeed in bad shape.

First off the person that wrote this article may have not know that the RU CV was designed without catapults.

Is the ship in such bad shape that she may sink? I don't know. I'd have to visit aboard. Also I'm unaware of any concern by the USN that she may sink. The USN has long shadowed Russian carriers & the Russian navy in general..

I've read other articles about the poor condition of this lone Russian CV. Nothing good about it. You cannot keep operating a ship and not properly maintain her and expect it to perform as designed.

As the Russians take delivery of their Mistral class LHD will they be able to maintain her? They'd better.



Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
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sarcasm mode on"
sailors and pilots around the world always like to sail and fly close to each other just to make sure if ships and planes from other countries get into trouble they can offer help immediately. during WWII, German sailor went through the extra step of performing surprise hull integrity tests by sneaking up on foreign ships underwater and launch these long metal tubes at them. you have no idea how many times catastrophic flaws were found during these surprise good will inspections. "
sarcasm mode off

really Popeye! how can you take that article seriously?
 
A

aksha

Captain
the vikram, why are they going in such a zig zag fashion . and at present nato ships going straight at it. instead f going to lisbon why further west from it.acording to the map.
 
F

Franklin

Captain
bd popeye said:
Apparently the person that wrote this article is unaware that the Russain CV Admiral Kuznetsov was never fitted with catapults.. otherwise an interesting article. How much truth is in the article? I do not know but I've read previous article the "ADM K" was indeed in bad shape.

First off the person that wrote this article may have not know that the RU CV was designed without catapults.

Is the ship in such bad shape that she may sink? I don't know. I'd have to visit aboard. Also I'm unaware of any concern by the USN that she may sink. The USN has long shadowed Russian carriers & the Russian navy in general..

I've read other articles about the poor condition of this lone Russian CV. Nothing good about it. You cannot keep operating a ship and not properly maintain her and expect it to perform as designed.

As the Russians take delivery of their Mistral class LHD will they be able to maintain her? They'd better.



Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
Click to expand...

The article does mention that the Admiral Kuznetsov lacks steam cats and uses a ski ramp for taking off planes. The story about the USN shadowing the Admiral Kuznetsov and her escort fleet in the Mediterranean out of fear that she may sink is true. This happened back in december of 2011. But i think its just an excuse for the USN to tail close to the Russian fleet.

As for the article itself its insulting and condescending towards the Admiral Kuznetsov and the Russian Navy and by extention towards the Russians and Russia.

As for the Admiral Kuznetsov she indeed has a checkered history of technical breakdowns and accidents. She was commissioned on 25 december 1990 and only in 1993 did she recieve her air wing. There has been a series of incidents involving the Admiral Kuznetsov in the years that followed and in 1997 to 98 she went into the docks for major repairs. In the years 2000 and 2001 she stayed at port for two years. Although that may have more to do with financial issue's rather then technical ones. The Admiral Kuznetsov went for a major overhaul in 2006 in order to try to fix many of her technical faults. That overhaul seems to have worked as afterward there are very few to no reports of problems on the Admiral Kuznetsov and she has sailed to the North Sea and the Mediterranean many times.

I think today the problem with the Admiral Kuznetsov is not about that the ship is not being properly maintained rather that the ship's technology is old and the ship is very uncomfortable for the crew. Because when the ship was designed and build in the Soviet days crew comfort was pretty low in priority and the Soviets was lacking in solid state electronics technology.

What the ship needs is a major refit, something similar to the Liaoning. There has been reports since 2010 of a major refit of the Admiral Kuznetsov in 2012 that may include a steam cat on the angled deck and there is even talk of a nuclear reactor being placed in her. But the sources of these reports is from a Russian naval publication and so far no official word from either the Russian navy or government so the entire story maybe apocryphal to begin with. We have to wait and see in 2014 or 2015 rather this refit will happen. But we know for sure that the ship will recieve new multi-role MiG-29K fighters. If the Russians are going to go for a Liaoning style refit it will take them 5 to 7 years to complete. The only shipyard in Russia that's able to do that is the one in Severodvinsk that help to refit the Vikramaditya. But considering the decade long saga and cost overruns with the Vikramaditya i'm not sure how comfortible the Russians will be to hand their sole carrier to them. And the Vikramaditya hasn't come out on the other end bristling with the latest electronics and instead looks pretty much the same as she went in. They just throw in a few computer screens in to the mix. But the interior still looks pretty much the same as that of the ships the Soviets build in the 1970's and 80's. And if the Russians do want to refit the ship they don't have access to the original design blue prints of the ship. China has got them. China bought those blue prints together with the Varyag haul and they paid 20 million dollars for the haul and another 10 million dollars for the blue prints. Its not impossible to refit the ship without the original design papers it just makes it more difficult.
 
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