Aircraft Carriers II (Closed to posting)

no_name said:

Does that not go the other way as well? I.e. the blind zone will also affect the torpedoes homing in on the ship.

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Well , that would depend on type of guidance :

- Straight and pattern-running torpedoes obviously would not be affected

- Wake-homing torpedoes should not be affected by much . In fact , during the 80s and 90s USN experimented with various methods to jam and spoof dangerous Soviet wake-homing torpedoes . One of the methods involved controlled explosions in ship's wake but no significant results were achieved .

- Wire-guided torpedoes depend on firing solution from submarine (or ship) . Most of the targeting systems on those platforms would try to extrapolate position of the target based on previous data (last known position , speed , course etc) . Since large ships cannot maneuver that fast , there is a pretty good chance they could not escape far enough to evade torpedo , especially if they are reacquired few dozens of seconds later .

- Finally ,acoustic torpedoes would almost certainly loose their targets in case of nearby underwater explosions . But again , in such circumstances they are per-programmed to head for the last known position of the target (in fact to head for last calculated intercepting point , but that is a whole different topic ) . Just like in the case of wire-guided torpedoes lot will depend on maneuverability of the targeted shop .

P.S. There are rumors about heat-seeking and magnetic torpedoes but I would not dwell on that . Obviously , if they exist in operational service , they would not be affected in this scenario .

no_name said:

Does that not go the other way as well? I.e. the blind zone will also affect the torpedoes homing in on the ship.

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There is absolutely NO DOWNSIDE to having removed at least one of the offensive torpedoes, and you may remove more than one in the process, it may indeed give you some "maneuvering room", so the fact that one threat has been eliminated will greatly increase your odds of survival. Brat

thunderchief said:

One of the methods involved controlled explosions in ship's wake but no significant results were achieved.

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The tests you speak were some time ago, and indeed were indeterminate.

Since then however, new methods have been added with much better guidance, which of course depends on acquisition and targeting of the oncoming torpedoes. The newer methods and technologies are targeting all types of torpedoes, and not just wake homing, though those are included. Those tests and development are ongoing.

Clearly, a large enough explosion underwater, set of very close to, and in front of the oncoming torpedo would destroy or disable it.

Jeff Head said:

The tests you speak were some time ago, and indeed were indeterminate.

Since then however, new methods have been added with much better guidance, which of course depends on acquisition and targeting of the oncoming torpedoes. The newer methods and technologies are targeting all types of torpedoes, and not just wake homing, though those are included. Those tests and development are ongoing.

Clearly, a large enough explosion underwater, set of very close to, and in front of the oncoming torpedo would destroy or disable it.

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I'm not talking about yet non-operational hard-kill anti-torpedo systems . I'm talking about jammers like AN/SQL-25C Nixie , relatively effective against acoustic torpedoes , but not that effective against wake-homing torpedoes (by USN own admission ) . In fact , supposedly there was a practice in USN to place a frigate in a wake of aircraft carrier (or other significant vessel ) just in case there was a torpedo attack :

Re: PLAN Carrier Operations..News, Videos & Photos II

^^^ I agree.. the USS Lexington was the USN training carrier until 1991. The USN no longer has a dedicated training CV.

Please read.

Reclassified as a training carrier and redesignated CVT-16, 1 January 1969.
CVT designation was rerated as "auxiliary," 23 September 1970.
Reclassified as auxiliary aircraft landing training ship, and redesignated AVT-16, 1 July 1978.
Lexington was the last Essex-class carrier in commission, and the last on the Naval Vessel Register.
Following her last qualification period, she had accomplished more than 493,000 arrested landings
Fate: Transferred as a museum ship to the USS Lexington Museum on the Bay, Corpus Christi, Texas, 15 June 1992.

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Re: PLAN Carrier Operations..News, Videos & Photos II

bd popeye said:

^^^ I agree.. the USS Lexington was the USN training carrier until 1991. The USN no longer has a dedicated training CV.

Please read.

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The "Blue Ghost," was something else.

Commissioned in 1943, she served in combat in World War II extensively:

- Kwajalein Raid (Where she was damaged by a Torpedo from an attacking Japanese aircraft)
- Battle of the Philippine Sea (Marianas Turkey Shoot)
- Battle of Leyte Gulf
- Attacks on Formosa
- Attacks on the Japanese Home Islands

She was rebuilt in the 1950s with the angled deck and a deck edge elevator and she served until 1991...last of the World War II Carriers to be decommissioned.

Here she is putting to sea in 1987 as a training carrier:


As built she displaced 36,300 tons. After her modifications, she displaced 48,300 tons. With her angled deck, large hanger spaces, steam catapults, arrested landing, jet blast deflectors, landing system, air conditioning, etc., if she were new today, she would represent one of the best carriers (outside of America's super, nuclear carriers) available.

Re: PLAN Carrier Operations..News, Videos & Photos II

Nice pic, Jeff.

Question: If I remember correctly, the Essex class carriers had open bows, with a pair of AA guns (40mm Bofors?) mounted there.

When did she get the enclosed (hurricane bow) - when she was given the angled deck, or later?

Did she keep her centerline lift?

What are those two triangular projections on the forward edge of her flight deck?

And lastly - what are the poles around the flight deck for?

Thanks.... he he he

Re: PLAN Carrier Operations..News, Videos & Photos II

duskylim said:

Nice pic, Jeff.

Question: If I remember correctly, the Essex class carriers had open bows, with a pair of AA guns (40mm Bofors?) mounted there.

When did she get the enclosed (hurricane bow) - when she was given the angled deck, or later?

Did she keep her centerline lift?

What are those two triangular projections on the forward edge of her flight deck?

And lastly - what are the poles around the flight deck for?

Thanks.... he he he

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1) The Angle deck and the enclosed bow were part of

popeye's ship. I was aboard when this photo was taken. USS Hancock (CVA-19) off San Diego, California, 11 February 1975, shortly before beginning her final deployment to the western Pacific. There are twelve A-4 Skyhawk attack planes and one SH-3 helicopter on her flight deck.

Note the centerline elevator has been removed.

Official U.S. Navy Photograph (# USN 1162018).

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2) The center line elevator aft was removed. The center line forward elevator was redesigned and retained.

3) Those are called "Cow(bridle) catchers". Certain aircraft used bridles to launch. Such as an A-4. In the photo below you can clearly see the bridle attached to the shuttle. The USN stopped catching bridles long before I served.



4) The poles are radio antennas.

Gents I'm/we're guilty of going off topic. Let's get back on topic!

Re: World News Thread & Breaking News!!

edit: accidental repeat, mods if you could please delete this. Thank You.

Re: PLAN Carrier Operations..News, Videos & Photos II

bd popeye said:

1) The Angle deck and the enclosed bow were part of

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Just one quick clarification. SCB-27 was a major overhaul which changed the carrier significantly in terms of underlying structure...however, the angled deck, hurricane bow, rebuilt island, etc. were all actually part of , which was a different upgrade.

For the Lexington, both upgrades were performed together and so are some times confused. For other Essex class, they were performed apart, sometimes years apart.

The SCB-125, even with the significant outward changes, was actually less time consuming (usually about nine months) and structurally altering than the SCB-27 (which could take up to two years). Lexington received the SCB-27C and SCB-125 starting n September 1953, when Lexington entered the Puget Sound Naval Shipyard. She then received the SCB-27C and SCB-125 conversions in one refit. She was recommissioned on 15 August 1955, three years later.

OK, back on topic.

Oooh...four fives, 5,555 on my posting count with this post. LOL!