Aircraft Carriers II (Closed to posting)

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Equation

Lieutenant General
V-22 is expensive though, if they are hard pressed for E2 Hawkeyes that maybe a push, although V22 would look awesome on QE Carriers!

True, but the V-22 could do more and bring Marines safely and quicker to their mission objectives than the CH-47 Chinook helicopter. The V-22 flies too high and too fast for insurgents on the ground to see and shoot down with a RPG.
 

Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
Some newer pics of the Indian INS Vikramaditya and the Mig-29Ks they are buying to fly off of her from my
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. The Indians have already received quite a few Mig-29Ks and the carrier is supposed to be turned over to them in December of this year...but there pilots have a training facility in India and have also trained onboard the Kusnetsov.

vikram-02.jpg

vikram-09.jpg

vikram-12.jpg

vikram-13.jpg

vikram-14.jpg

vikram-16.jpg

vikram-17.jpg

vikram-18.jpg
 

asif iqbal

Lieutenant General
Some newer pics of the Indian INS Vikramaditya and the Mig-29Ks they are buying to fly off of her from my
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. The Indians have already received quite a few Mig-29Ks and the carrier is supposed to be turned over to them in December of this year...but there pilots have a training facility in India and have also trained onboard the Kusnetsov.
]


currently india has 12 Mig29Ks and 4 Mig29KUBs flying with intensive flying trials unit (IFTU), the first sqaudron is due to be opertional within a year with 29 more Mig29K/KUBs duie to enter service between now and end of 2013

eventually India will add more Mig29s to thier naval inventory before ordering a new generation naval fighter post -2020
 
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Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
currently india has 12 Mig29Ks and 4 Mig29KUBs flying with intensive flying trials unit (IFTU), the first sqaudron is due to be opertional within a year with 29 more Mig29K/KUBs duie to enter service between now and end of 2013

eventually India will add more Mig29s to thier naval inventory before ordering a new generation naval fighter post -2020
Exactly, and that is one reason I think the Indians will actually have the Vikramaditya fully operational and qualified for air ops before the PLAN does with the new carrier that is already launched and in trials...even though the Indian carrier will be a year behind them. They will have the aircraft and trained pilots for a full squadron for that carrier well before the PLAN does, I believe.
 
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asif iqbal

Lieutenant General
i think so too

but India has operated carriers for more than half a century, they do have alot of experience in operating carriers, but nothing high temp, and briefly operated 2 carriers, INS Vikrant and INS Viraat

INS Vikramaditya is set to be handed over to the Indian navy before this year is out, so it will be up and running fully within 1-2 years, but like so many Indo-Russia projects we will believe it when we see it, India has a very bad habbit of suddenly changing requirments up and till ships are inducted no one knows when it will sail

Varyag still doesnt have a fully equipped air wing and is still under trials, but i think its not bad job for China, since they only really started serious work after 2006 whereas INS Vikramaditya (Admiral Gorshkov) was signed start 2004, plus China had to learn everything from scratch

my prediction is, if China is serious and started to build a indigenous aircraft carrier they could get it out before the new 45,000 ton Vikrant class carrier sails~2017 but with a few years on top for delays

did u know INS Shivalik a indian frigate was laid in 2001, and was only commisioned last year or 2 years ago!!

INS Sahyadri was laid in 2003 and still isnt commisioned!!!
 
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Obi Wan Russell

Jedi Master
VIP Professional
The Indian Navy has had a frontline carrier based FJ strike sqn for five decades, (300INAS,'The White Tigers'), originally operating Hawker Sea Hawks (1962-1983) then Sea Harrier FRS 51s (1983-present) so they have a sizeable degree of 'corporate' carrier experience. Added to that they formed a second FJ frontline sqn last year (303INAS, 'The Black Panthers') to operate the Mig-29Ks and KUBs, acting initially as the type's IFTU/OEU/OCU* to prepare the pilots and ground crew for the initial embarkation, probably early next year once Vikramaditya is fully operational. When the Sea Harrier is eventually withdrawn from service (no firm date, but high attrition rates mean that there are barely enough left to put a full sqn to sea, and the recent upgrade did not include refurbishment of the airframe or engines), 300INAS will likely convert to the Mig-29K also.

*Intensive Flying Trials Unit/Operational Evaluation Unit/Operational Conversion Unit.
 

Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
Asif Iqbal said:
Varyag still doesnt have a fully equipped air wing and is still under trials, but i think its not bad job for China, since they only really started serious work after 2006 whereas INS Vikramaditya (Admiral Gorshkov) was signed start 2004, plus China had to learn everything from scratch
Yes they have. This new carrier is impressive and will be a potent vessel with a couple of squadrons of J-15s aboard along with the various helo types, along with the escort vessels the PLAN has developed.

I expect the PLAN carrier to be fully operational with at least one squadron of fully trained and operational J-15s by late 2014.

The Indian Navy has had a frontline carrier based FJ strike sqn for five decades, (300INAS,'The White Tigers'), originally operating Hawker Sea Hawks (1962-1983) then Sea Harrier FRS 51s (1983-present) so they have a sizeable degree of 'corporate' carrier experience. Added to that they formed a second FJ frontline sqn last year (303INAS, 'The Black Panthers') to operate the Mig-29Ks and KUBs, acting initially as the type's IFTU/OEU/OCU* to prepare the pilots and ground crew for the initial embarkation, probably early next year once Vikramaditya is fully operational. When the Sea Harrier is eventually withdrawn from service (no firm date, but high attrition rates mean that there are barely enough left to put a full sqn to sea, and the recent upgrade did not include refurbishment of the airframe or engines), 300INAS will likely convert to the Mig-29K also.

*Intensive Flying Trials Unit/Operational Evaluation Unit/Operational Conversion Unit.
Interesting times in Asia. I believe India will have the first Asian fixed wing carrier fully operational with the Vikramaditya, followed by China with the ex-Varyag. Then it will be a race between the two between the Vikrant and the 1st indegenous Chinese carrier...which I think the Indians will win also because theres is well over 50% built and they will have the additional Mig-29K squadron all ready by then.

Both intend a third, and that one is too far out to see who will get the third one first.

In the mean time during the same period we will see Australia launch their Canberaa vessels, Japan launch its two new, larger 22DDH vessels, and perhaps at least a second Dokdo by Korea.

I think it quite possible that the Australian Canberras and the JMSDF 22DDHs will ultimately have F-35Bs on them..
 
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Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
To my eyes, this clearly signals AEW as a capability the RN will not risk losing like it did last time carriers were axed. Heliborne AEW can be deployed from any ship in the fleet of Frigate size upwards, and partners the T45 very well in task force defence. Provided the carriers enter service as hoped AEW aircraft will be part of the air group, but even with the CATOBAR configuration, I don't see anything other than Merlin ASaC being provided before the mid 2020s simply because nothing else can be afforded in the meantime. What money is available will have to go on completing the carriers and buying the fighters first.

And when the Carrier is ready, along with the fighters and the Darings, along with the Astutes...here's what they are going to look like together.

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bd popeye

The Last Jedi
VIP Professional
Found this about the Russian CV ADM"K" at mp.net.

Excellent photos by the way.

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I'm not sure of the validity of the following from the link provided. Somethings are lost in the translation.

The ship has ill fame and the phrase “If you misbehave, you’ll be sent to the Kuznetsov” is a norm. Read below to find out why.
The ship features 7 decks and 2 platforms, stern-part and fore-part machinery and boiler compartments, 5 engine compartments, a 150-meter long warehouse(hangar?), 6 galleys, a lock up and a guardroom.

To begin with, the ship has no heating because an auxiliary boiler is missing. So it’s not bad when it’s +5C in the cockpit and it’s a luxury when it’s +12C in there.

Electric heaters help the personnel out. Yet they are expensive and not easy to buy so the seamen have to assemble them by themselves to later have their “off-design equipment withdrawn”.

Unfortunately, that’s not all about the heating. When it’s this cold, water freezes everywhere including pipes which may cause a rupture. To prevent this, they just don’t supply almost 60% of the cabins with water (neither in winter nor in summer). The situation with latrines is just as bad. The ship has over 50 latrines but half of them are closed.

As for its ventilation, 50% of the ventilators broke down. Considering the fact that there are very few portholes on the ship, it is difficult to imagine how terrible it smells in here (it smells like mold and it’s very stuffy).

Speaking about the wardroom, it is missing too(The wardroom is the galley for officers in the US Navy). Instead, there is a cafeteria seating up to 150 persons ( there are 2,000 people in the crew).There are no tablecloths in the cafeteria and it is highly recommendable to wipe your cutlery before using it. As for its food, it’s Ok but it’s better not to be late because they steal it sometimes so it may be gone by the time you come.

The ship’s ill fame results in high stuff turnover. Experienced sailors are replaced with inexperienced ones and contract soldiers are the only way out.

The personnel consist of mostly people from far away villages because those from the cities believe evading proves their high social status. This can be applied to Russians while Caucasian people think the other way round. It is a matter of honor for them to serve in the army and serving in the navy is their dream. As for people from Bashkiria or Tuva, they probably don’t know how to evade yet. As a result, every 10th draftee doesn’t speak Russian.

Theft is another problem of the Admiral Kuznetsov. They supply the ship with pierced canned food but they still manage to sell it at a lower cost to factory workers. “You gotta hustle if you wanna survive”.(huh??)
 

kwaigonegin

Colonel
Yes they have. This new carrier is impressive and will be a potent vessel with a couple of squadrons of J-15s aboard along with the various helo types, along with the escort vessels the PLAN has developed.

I expect the PLAN carrier to be fully operational with at least one squadron of fully trained and operational J-15s by late 2014.

Interesting times in Asia. I believe India will have the first Asian fixed wing carrier fully operational with the Vikramaditya, followed by China with the ex-Varyag. Then it will be a race between the two between the Vikrant and the 1st indegenous Chinese carrier...which I think the Indians will win also because theres is well over 50% built and they will have the additional Mig-29K squadron all ready by then.

Both intend a third, and that one is too far out to see who will get the third one first.

In the mean time during the same period we will see Australia launch their Canberaa vessels, Japan launch its two new, larger 22DDH vessels, and perhaps at least a second Dokdo by Korea.

I think it quite possible that the Australian Canberras and the JMSDF 22DDHs will ultimately have F-35Bs on them..


With all the modern naval assets and unimaginable firepower coming online above and the continued boosting of the US 7th, the Pacific Ocean will be soon become a very very small place! Very interesting times indeed in the forseeable future! Let's hope and pray everyone is calm and nobody does nuttin stoopid.
 
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