A New Cold War?

Index

Senior Member
Registered Member
An invasion is not going to happen but an attack is possible. How about using ICBM's with conventional warheads?

Granted an ICBM is probably the most expensive way to deliver a bomb measured in (cost per kilogram) so the quantity of the payload and the number of missiles would be very limited. I'm not sure how much military value this would have but a successful attack on the CONUS would have a very powerful psychological impact. Americans are not accustomed to the actual mainland under attack.
America's most productive "provinces" are not on the mainland, but in the form of SK and Japan. Those regions are ranked 2 and 3rd after China in semiconductor production and shipbuilding. They also have most of the heavy industry that US empire can access. If you're feeling spicy, Australia too because of its abundance of raw resources.

If China captures these regions, US will be unable to replenish advanced weapons and unable to sustain international civilian shipping industry. The ability of US to build ships by tonnage is 230 times less than China and 100 times less than SK.

With these areas under control, China can also blackmail any third party to stop trade with US, or else risk not receiving any vital civilian goods.

China cannot credibly move against the US mainland at the moment, the distances are too large and the number of troops needed too many. However, taking inspiration from the strategy of Japan in ww1 and ww2 which was also facing a more populous but less industrialised power, the goal to subjugate a larger power can be achieved by waging a first war to seize the opponent's most productive regions, inducing despair and political turmoil in the enemy state.

After consolidating an occupation of the 2nd island chain, China can then project power freely into the east Pacific, letting them shape and threaten US as needed. Without it's most productive regions, US can only sustain lower tech industries, and will not be in a position to challenge China again.
 

phrozenflame

Junior Member
Registered Member
If China captures these regions, US will be unable to replenish advanced weapons and unable to sustain international civilian shipping industry. The ability of US to build ships by tonnage is 230 times less than China and 100 times less than SK.

With these areas under control, China can also blackmail any third party to stop trade with US, or else risk not receiving any vital civilian goods.
China aiming to 'capture' these places would be akin to repeating mistakes of US's attempts to do so in Vietnam, Afghanistan and Iraq. It's also quite unrealistic in this day and age. The mistake of Afghanistan and Iraq were huge failures in context of great-power politics.

US spent money, men & attention on these while China developed economically, away from pressures. Without these wars, the kind of actions we're seeing against China now may have started occuring 1-2 decades earlier. Capturing Japan and SK, while possible, tho, they'd just be bleeding wound taking resources away from what really matters - The economy.

The cold war will be won on economic front through innovation primarily and other factors will follow. Luckily for China, CCP knows this and that's the primary focus. They arent screwing there economy to pour crazy resources in to arms race like USSR did. Instead, they're pouring crazy resources into innovation and drive the economy.

We're seeing the results of that, the economy is driving the milltary growth in quality and quantity.

Few months ago, USAF said they'd be lucky to field 6th gen fighter months aheado of China. Since then, US doesnt have funds for 6th gen fighter in it's intended ideal design and it's essentially back to the drawing board. Same thing occurred with Zumwalt. The days of funding bleeding-edge feature creep seem to be over. They're not even able to afford next-gen long range artillery shells these days. Only the printing of dollar is keeping the current order afloat. That also has it's limits and they're approaching that slowly. They're at a critical juncture where they need to increase spending to contain China, but instead they are faced with a situation where they have to cut funding here and there to balance things out. US has had market-driven innovation edge for a lot of decades and it's still a great place for innovation, saying otherwise is putting blinders on your eyes, they still are able to attract the best talent at this point in time. China doesnt has the need to attract as it brews the talent locally and you dont have to be a debt serf to build that talent through education.

However, the current US system is not perfect, and so many of the industries have also stagnated as they pursued short-term shareholder value creation over long-term strategic domination. When threatened, they used their muscle to cut down the competition like it was done to Japan.

It's an interesting competition and we're all alive in this interesting period of time in human history where two powers, stronger than anything before them compete for the top-dawg slot. Grab your popcorns and keep reading sinodefense. :D
 

phrozenflame

Junior Member
Registered Member
View attachment 135461

Key US resolutions this week to counter China
So, they're down to just 2-3 industrial segments to maintain lead through non-market forces - Biotech and AI SC tech. And in drones and battery, i think they'll have to eventually relent unless local industry suddenly pops up. These may go to if they dont pour resources efficiently into these segments.

A freind of mine worked in [redacted] and then [redacted] (Engineering companies with industrial products, global leaders in some of their fields), I wont get into specific industrial segment. Few years ago, I asked him how is Chinese competition, he said, there are no worries, nothing on the horizon. I met him again and asked the question again. He said, now they dont even bid in certain countries if there is a Chinese bid, as it's a waste time and effort as China will win the bid 90% of the time. Also, alot of their distributors were taken over by Chinese or Chinese backed organisations became distributors/channel partners as they offered better trade terms to end consuomers. They're literally handing over their industrial products to Chinese backed partners to continue the business. And ofcourse, the knowledge gained by these partners is being passed back home. This is an example of one sector, imagine this happening all over the place. US simply cant fight on all fronts, there is well thought out and planned CCP strategy in action. You wont see journalists report on this because it's not 'click baity' enough. My 2 paisas of interesting real world insights for you all to consume :p.

Edit: Redacting the names of the organisations as I know the forums do get some attention and I dont want any of that for myself :)
 
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Index

Senior Member
Registered Member
China aiming to 'capture' these places would be akin to repeating mistakes of US's attempts to do so in Vietnam, Afghanistan and Iraq. It's also quite unrealistic in this day and age. The mistake of Afghanistan and Iraq were huge failures in context of great-power politics.
The difference is that US was not interested in even ruling these areas. They installed military regimes that treated all the locals as essentially subhuman and had no long term visions for the area.

Culturally, there are vast differences as well. Asians, if the ruling party is also Asian, are going to be more accepting of authority in general. A Korean under Chinese rule can pass as somewhat Chinese just by learning Chinese.

Is an Asia encompassing empire possible in terms of security and integration? If we observe in history, yes. Despite the extreme cruelty against their occupied territory, today, the Empire of Japan is actually praised among South Korean and Taiwan right wing, Thailand, Philippines and other SEA countries. This tells me that with a much lighter hand from China, there may be initial popular conflicts, but the prevailing mood will, as illogically as it sounds, shift towards far higher levels of pro-China belief than if China didn't occupy them.

And while Imperial Japan only provided the most basic long term subject plans yet this was enough to buy gratitude especially among SEA, China has real experience in developing areas and a vision for an Asia based world order, for example with the GSI and so on. China can, unlike Japan in the past, offer a real path towards high income.

Technology arms race is real, but imo it's naive to believe that the ultimate reason behind tech race isn't to eventually enable the use of force. If Britain had only declared victory by having better tech than Qing, could they have reached the power they got without looting the wealth of their main rival? The same applies to PRC as well. They can have all the tech advantages in the world, but they still eventually need to pry open the doors of the west and take over their accumulated wealth.

Whether it be by overwhelming invasion in a grand pacific war or a smaller war primarily focused on destroying enemy government stability like the opium war, China needs an explosive moment to ensure western civilization will play ball for the foreseeable future. At the very least, open trade lanes, open investment and non-discrimination guarantee against Chinese businesses.
 
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ACuriousPLAFan

Brigadier
Registered Member
A cold front in the new Cold War:

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Honestly wondering whether China should build a small fleet of warships that are tailored towards operations beyond the Arctic Circle (i.e. with equipment and modules that can better withstand and operate under extreme cold conditions in the region), or are the present PLAN warships largely sufficient for Arctic operations?

One idea would be for these Arctic-conditioned warships to have temporary/seasonal presence in the Arctic region by basing out of Russian naval bases, and conduct joint exercises/operations with the Russian warships in the Arctic region.

This could (if not should) be coupled with the longer-term objective of establishing an entry and presence into the Atlantic Ocean from the northern route, namely via the GIUK gap (particularly the SSGNs and SSBNs).
 
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