TerraN_EmpirE
Tyrant King
If it's true and if we can find out who they are.
2014 Ukrainian Maidan Revolt: News, Views, Photos & Videos
- Thread starter bd popeye
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Well, what a newspaper article reports on a particular day is not real evidence of any governmental or major economic authority recommending such illegal acts by business leadership.
I presume you are talking about the US finaincial crisis now? 1st what one considers immoral...or even unethical...is not the same as criminal behavior. The former is what people probably ought not to do, but not against the law. The latter is patently illegal and is against the law.delft said:
And, besides, that was something that happened in the US which had many, many more issues influencing it (like the fact that politicians passed laws forcing banks to sell houses at sub prime rates to bad credit risks (all in the name of buying more votes for those credit risks because they could now tell them that they, the politicians, got them their piece of the "American dream), and then the banks, knowing full well that the risk was bad, sold them to other institutions so they could get out from under what the politicans had forced them to do...and ultimately speculators did exactly what you describe and was so rampant that it almost brought the whole system down). The main reason for it was, as I say, politicans of a cerrtain ilk making laws when they had the majority, that were foolish to begin with and done in the name of pure politics. Anyhow, we could go on and on about that...but let's not. It's off topic here.
Some of them may well not be. And that is bad. But that is one of the reasons I am sure many of the Ukrainians hope to be able to get to the EU, because they hope that there is a much higher semblance of the rule of law thetre than what they are currently living with...or what they see as the personification of oligarchy (erightly or wrongly) in the leadership of Russia...except they see it there as official and at the national level.delft said:
My hope is simply that the parties do not over react, or act rashly and get themselves into a real war, which would make everything much worse for the people...the citizens who will be most adversly effected by it.
You know, one of the things that is great about SD is that we have some exceptional people here who are in the know and who post here and can give us information about what we are seeing and hearing long before the rest of the world (particularly the news agencies) catch on.
Case in point is the "armed men" who took over the Crimea government buildings yestewrday and then the airports in the Crimea earlier today. As pictures began to leak out and get shown here, we had members (in this case in particular Terran_Empire) who indicated that those were not only Russian uniforms...top of the line...but that because of their arms, webbing, etc, that they were Russian soldirs.
Now, we have the press reporting all over the place that the Russian military is on the ground in the Crimea. Probably initially from the Naval Base there, but now more and more through those very airports they have taken control of. One quote from the Urkaine is now that, "Thirteen Russian aircraft landed at the airport of Gvardeyskoye with 150 soldiers in each one," And this is already taking place as Obama and Kerry keep up their prattle about the Russians better not put troops on the ground or there will be "consequences." Yea, Barry, sure...sort of like the "Red Line," in Syria that you first said was drawn in the sand...and then later you said you never said. Sure.
Fact is, we know now that the Russian Mmilitary is on the ground in the Crimea.
The Ukraine has to be very, very careful now. They should themselves deploy their troops to the borders of the other provinces and the nation...but in NO WAY attack or fight the Russians already in the Crimea. That is a trap. It will giv Putin the pretext he will need to send in more and more and Urkaine could lose most of its nation.
If they stand forceful...and prepared...at those other areas, making the Russians come to them, and then protest loudly to the international community in the hopes of forming a strong coaltion, then they have a much better chance in the sort run and the long run. But that will take time and they cannot afford to get immediately embroiled with a much stronger and more capable, and deeper, Russian force at this point.
Case in point is the "armed men" who took over the Crimea government buildings yestewrday and then the airports in the Crimea earlier today. As pictures began to leak out and get shown here, we had members (in this case in particular Terran_Empire) who indicated that those were not only Russian uniforms...top of the line...but that because of their arms, webbing, etc, that they were Russian soldirs.
Now, we have the press reporting all over the place that the Russian military is on the ground in the Crimea. Probably initially from the Naval Base there, but now more and more through those very airports they have taken control of. One quote from the Urkaine is now that, "Thirteen Russian aircraft landed at the airport of Gvardeyskoye with 150 soldiers in each one," And this is already taking place as Obama and Kerry keep up their prattle about the Russians better not put troops on the ground or there will be "consequences." Yea, Barry, sure...sort of like the "Red Line," in Syria that you first said was drawn in the sand...and then later you said you never said. Sure.
Fact is, we know now that the Russian Mmilitary is on the ground in the Crimea.
Market Watch said:
Fox News said:
The Ukraine has to be very, very careful now. They should themselves deploy their troops to the borders of the other provinces and the nation...but in NO WAY attack or fight the Russians already in the Crimea. That is a trap. It will giv Putin the pretext he will need to send in more and more and Urkaine could lose most of its nation.
If they stand forceful...and prepared...at those other areas, making the Russians come to them, and then protest loudly to the international community in the hopes of forming a strong coaltion, then they have a much better chance in the sort run and the long run. But that will take time and they cannot afford to get immediately embroiled with a much stronger and more capable, and deeper, Russian force at this point.
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Equation
Lieutenant General
If true, this would be great material for your mercenary thread!
Mercenary or not, they conducted they carry out their military operations pretty proficient. Most of them don't even have their unit insignia's on their uniforms or any id on their BDU (battle dress uniforms) at least from what I've seen on television lately. Russian black ops perhaps?
Guys, talk about the US sending unprepared ambassadors to China and elsewhere, outside of the Ukraine, while interesting and perhaps pathetic, is still completely off topic on this thread. Partuclarly as this situation in the Ukraine has heated up significantly today. Please...
STAY ON TOPIC
I am removing those off topic comments and moving them to the "What the Heck?" thread.
Thanks.
STAY ON TOPIC
I am removing those off topic comments and moving them to the "What the Heck?" thread.
Thanks.
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Broccoli
Senior Member
After Obama's "red line" in Syria it's quite clear that Putin knows he's a weak leader, and Russians knows that US liberals are defeatist pacifists who won't do anything. Russians are doing anything to get Ukrainians "bite" so they have excuse to attack... they did same in Georgia and Shakasvili was stupid enough to do it.
If Russia get's way from taking Crimea it's over for small NATO countries like Estonia because Russians know that west doesn't do anything.
If Russia get's way from taking Crimea it's over for small NATO countries like Estonia because Russians know that west doesn't do anything.
Russia's do or die strategic necessity to influence Ukraine and hold Crimea, is in a completely different league to any designs they might have over Estonia.
Certainly it is alarmist and unrealistic IMHO to think Putin will go for another sovereign country simply because they managed to possibly hold onto Crimea. It is a completely different game.
Certainly it is alarmist and unrealistic IMHO to think Putin will go for another sovereign country simply because they managed to possibly hold onto Crimea. It is a completely different game.
Well, I am not so sure about that.
This will lead to a very much strengthening of NATO and the EU. Poland, Hungary, the Baltics, GErmany, etc. will all stiffen up significantly and show resolve. I expect at this point that Russia is going to control Crimea...now that they have committed troops. It will probably end up like the Provinces in Georgia. Crimea will vote for Independence and they will ask Russia to be their protectorate.
Russia will retain the Crimea and the base at Sevastapol pemanently without worry about a lease to a Ukriane alinged with the EU.
That's what is happening here.
The Ukraine is going to have to accept this now...as is the EU. Short of some type of foreign policy/negotiating miracle, I am afraid it is too late to prevent or do anything about.
The Ukraine has to immediately see to the security of their other bodres and defend them, but not attack the Russian forces.
If Obama wanted to show any type of strength at all...he would have started sending C-17 aircraft with advisors, provisions, trainers, and its own security Force to Kiev day before yestterday...or maybe now. Not as a military force to fight the Russians, but as a warning to Russia that to go any further will neccessitate rolling over American soldiers. The EU should do the same thing.
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Equation
Lieutenant General
Hey Jeff have you heard anything from your Ukrainian friends regarding the former PM Yanukovich and that the new government are planning to press charges on him and demand Russia to turn him over?
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