056 class FFL/corvette

duskylim said:

Sir - I would argue that the old Jianghu is the test-ship for this launcher. They seem to have removed the old (gun turret?) to install it.

That mount would not affect the sea-worthiness and sea-keeping of the old Jianghu.

One could not say the same for the 056, the mount above the hangar roof must have serious top-weight and strength limitations, too heavy and stability is affected - not to mention the hangar roof caves in.

As the 056 is a coastal patrol vessel the 8-round launcher is probably at the limit.

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It's where the dual AAA mounts used to be, so it's one deck above the main deck, though the 8 round launcher on the 056 seems to 2 decks above the main deck.

It also makes me wonder what's the actual weight difference between the 8 round and 24 round. Judging from the size relative to Jianghu super structure, it doesn't seem to be much bigger than the 8-round launcher.

edit:
Though 8 rounds would seem enough now, with the tension in the South China Sea. It's would be good to a option to go to heavier armaments. Since if the shooting starts, these ships would have serious trouble defending itself from even the modest air treats from Vietnam or Philippines (once they got their Golden Eagles). Even though they probably won't sent to combat, it's not a good idea to leave them vulnerable during stand offs, and if PLAN do indeed make 30-40 of these thing, it would be a waste to have them stuck in ports when a shooting war starts.

The 056 does not have a hanger and the design allows for a helicopter's weight on the aft aviation deck. If they wanted to install a FL-3000 system with more rounds, I thnk they could do it. If there are structural concerns I am sure that they could reinforce the structure that the FL-3000 is mounted on.

Personally, I am suspicious of the 24 round FL-3000 on the Jianghu. Until I see more photos, I'm not entirely convinced.

luhai said:

It's where the dual AAA mounts used to be, so it's one deck above the main deck, though the 8 round launcher on the 056 seems to 2 decks above the main deck.

It also makes me wonder what's the actual weight difference between the 8 round and 24 round. Judging from the size relative to Jianghu super structure, it doesn't seem to be much bigger than the 8-round launcher.

edit:
Though 8 rounds would seem enough now, with the tension in the South China Sea. It's would be good to a option to go to heavier armaments. Since if the shooting starts, these ships would have serious trouble defending itself from even the modest air treats from Vietnam or Philippines (once they got their Golden Eagles). Even though they probably won't sent to combat, it's not a good idea to leave them vulnerable during stand offs, and if PLAN do indeed make 30-40 of these thing, it would be a waste to have them stuck in ports when a shooting war starts.

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I don't believe the Golden Eagles are capable of carrying AShMs? For the 056, 24 rounds makes it overkill and I suspect like others, top heavy. If an air threat such as one from Vietnam had to fire 8 rounds at a 056, that's gotta be one determined pilot. Or some directive from up top to sink that 056 at all costs which would implicate a much more serious development than just a random hostile engagement.

If there's any mods or additions, I rather see an extension of the hull with perhaps an extra section module to put another 8 cell FL-3000N on front half of the ship to provide 360 coverage.

The 056 is designed as a coastal patrol vessel, not a front line combatant. It's main function is to keep the peace, and fly the flag during stand-offs, not winning shooting wars. As such, giving them 24 round FL3000 launchers would be way overkill and a waste of resources.

It's armaments are aimed primarily at dealing with pirates and hijackers, with the upper limit being able to deal with a corvette of similar displacement from a hostile nation in a one-on-one clash.

That FL3000 launcher is intended to stop 2-4 AShMs, which is about the maximum load a corvette of that size will typically have.

The 056 is designed to win an accidental firefight where things just escalates out of all control and the captains on the scene had to make a snap call.

If someone was planning on launching a pre-meditated attack, by say, scrambling a flight of Flankers or other fighters with a full AShM load, well, even on 054A would struggle to deal with such an attack, never mind an 056.

In such an extreme scenario, whether the 056 has an 8 or 24 cell launcher will not matter much, and the job of the 056 in such a case is simply to die in the place of a more capable platform with a far bigger crew, thus alerting China to the intensions of the hostile nation and giving China the justification to bring it's full military might to bare in retaliation.

The 056 would also have it's uses during a full scale shooting war, and will most likely be used as a sub chaser to provide a mobile ASW screen and extend the range of helos from the rest of the task force by allowing them to land and refuel on the helipad.

Since the 056 will be operating under the cover of friendly fighters and naval SAM screens, it will not need anything more than point defense missilesin case a few leakers get through. Even then the 056 will only realistically be a target because of an accident where an incoming missile locked onto it by accident since the enemy would want to target the bigger ships of the task group as a priority, as such, the 8 cell launcher should be more than adequate even in a full scale war.

luhai said:

Just saw this today, it boggles my mind this the 24 round RAM is on the older Jianghu but 056 OPV only get 8 round. They are more or less in the same class of ships, and 056 would benefit from the extra rounds.
View attachment 7136

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If it come the time that needs to spend more than 4 SAM, the 056 would be in for a fight that it's not designed for - it's designed as a step-up from the outdated sub-chasers, missile boats and even older frigates the PLAN is operating, profiled for low intensity ops that at most fighting non-missile-carrying surface combatants (like the ex-Hamilton class cutters), but at least got enough defense capability to survive initial missile strikes and pull back to friendly waters.

Jianghu class maybe totally obsolete but it'd still be a while before they get their replacements, FL-3000 is there to cover the final leg of service lifespan.

IMO if the Chinese Navy wanted, it wouldn't be difficult to build a larger 056 with HQ-18 in front and back like the K130. The question would be cost vs benefit & performance. If the security situation was much worse, then I would expect more armaments on deck.

Also, if the goal was to improve the AAW capability, wouldn't it be better to invest in MR-SAM systems?

The AK130 itself has an AA function which would allow the 056 to use it to engage air threats in the front of the ship.

If the security situation was worse, the PLAN would send in 054As or 052C/Ds to back up the 056s.

The 056's main job is to fly the flag, and its best defense is also the said flag, because it is not the armaments onboard that keeps the 056 safe from a determined attack, it is what China will do to anyone who would launch such an attack that give those who might try pause.

Even if you build all your ships to AB Flight III standard, a determined attacker could still have a good chance of sinking it in a surprise attack. If and when the PLAN sends on 056 into a contested area, it is not supposed to be some unsinkable super-ship that can sole the navy and air force of an entire nation.

The 056 is supposed to be a not too intimidating avatar of Chinese interests, it has the armaments to win small scale skirmishes, and it will take a well co-ordinated and determined attack to sink one of them. The sweet spot in terms of the design aim of the 056 is that it is well armed enough to have a better than good chance of surviving and winning a truly unintentional firefight against a likely opponent, yet be cheap each to build in large numbers. The only attack that would have a good chance to penetrating the 056's defenses would be a pre-meditated attack that would be all by impossible to pass off as anything else, thus giving China justification to bring it's big guns to bare without worrying about being branded as a bully.

plawolf said:

The AK130 itself has an AA function which would allow the 056 to use it to engage air threats in the front of the ship.

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You mean AK-176.

plawolf said:

The AK130 itself has an AA function which would allow the 056 to use it to engage air threats in the front of the ship.....

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superdog said:

You mean AK-176.

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Did not know the AK-176 is capable of shooting down missiles so it makes sense now for me. AK-176 for front coverage, FL-3000N for rear.