054B/new generation frigate

Surpluswarrior said:

Is there a role for a 'frigate leader' or 'heavy frigate' in the PLAN today? To lead and datalink 054A? Or would that be the role of destroyers?

In the interwar period and beyond, there were 'destroyer leaders' and 'flotilla leaders.'

The 'flotilla leaders' had greater room for staff and communications, to co-ordinate the smaller warships. I suppose PLAN has many 052 and larger vessels to fulfill that role.

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There is something remotely similar with upgraded older, non-aegis destroyers.

ACuriousPLAFan said:

054B FFG #555 Qinzhou has entered service with the PLAN. Posted by @xx笑而不语xx on Weibo.

View attachment 148108

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Is the fleet or homeport known?

Gloire_bb said:

...stealth aircraft(from f-35 to soon to come b-21), new generation cruise missiles (from Vietnam to Philippine based MLRs to Japan to Taiwan, or whomever who can be in conflict in the next 50 years really), ballistic missiles, drones of all kinds.

F-35B with LRASM was shown just yesterday, for example.

Even if right around today afternoon there will be fake flag incident in Red sea with Chinese vessel (or genuine mistake, or plot, whatever) - Houthi weapons include dissimilar salvoes with TBMs inside.

China doesn't live deep in an insulated co-prosperity sphere, with Malay barrier firmly occupied and global east-west traffic non-existent. And the last one didn't exactly prevent all kinds of escort activity.
Chinese traffic goes all around the world, Chinese crucial traffic stretches at very least to the gulf area (which is boiling at an edge).

054A as a ship can't be expected to reliably process simple benchmark attacks - it's a ship relying mostly on a single 382 (i.e. top plate), without proper CMS. I.e. for all intents, it's a 1980s capability level, just with higher rate of fire.
Much less big model threats, it isn't all that inconceivable for such a ship to get surprised by a handful of light ASCMs; yes, with a good crew and when fully ready they can make it. They may be not.
It certainly isn't inconceivable for it to miss the same ASCM when it's attacking other, escorted, ship at some distance away.

But if you get those 054As even a single modern dual band flagship - they'll become massively better. They just need this warning/information support

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Except that none of these are low end threats. You would never send a 054A out alone if there was a significant risk of being attacked by stealth aircraft or a saturation missile attack. Hell, you would never even send a 055 out alone if there were a significant risk it could get attacked by stealth aircraft or a saturation missile attack. Those are high end threats demanding high end defenses, such as would be provided by SAGs and CSGs. Low end threats such as submarine attacks, missile/gun boats, and random patrolling enemy corvettes/frigates/CG cutters is what the 054A would be expected to face alone or as a small group of 054As during the few missions it would be relegated to: ASW, convoy escort, and near seas wartime patrol.

BTW I don't see any reason it couldn't handle a LRASM or two, not that it would even be exposed to such a threat in the first place. Philippines, Singapore, India, Indonesia, etc. don't have this missile and are not inclined to attack China in the first place. Korea attacking China would be suicidal. You basically are looking at Japanese and American assets, neither of which would attack with lone F-35Bs in the First Island Chain, and if there were a risk of them doing so, no 054A would be sent out to fend for itself in such a high risk environment. Maybe Australia would try to sneak a Collins in there (highly doubtful). Maybe France and UK may try to sneak an SSN into the fray (highly doubtful). But that's what you're looking at. Lone subs trying to pick off your commerce. Maybe an LCS trying to sneak in there to cause trouble. Larger forces would be more easily detected and would not be met by 054As in those cases.

Iron Man said:

Except that none of these are low end threats. You would never send a 054A out alone if there was a significant risk of being attacked by stealth aircraft or a saturation missile attack. Hell, you would never even send a 055 out alone if there were a significant risk it could get attacked by stealth aircraft or a saturation missile attack. Those are high end threats demanding high end defenses, such as would be provided by SAGs and CSGs. Low end threats such as submarine attacks, missile/gun boats, and random patrolling enemy corvettes/frigates/CG cutters is what the 054A would be expected to face alone or as a small group of 054As during the few missions it would be relegated to: ASW, convoy escort, and near seas wartime patrol.

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Those are threats that can pop up literally everywhere, right to China's shore (which is painfully big and has crazy amounts of vulnerable traffic). Even when you develop protection plans for that coastal traffic, you have to take them into account.
Seas around China are just too large to be tightly controlled, but crossing them with aircraft (even non vlo, at lower altitude) is fast enough. All possible kinds of land features around China to the South are sources of attack, and in case of Taiwan, Philippines and japanese islands are explicitly developed as such.
Indian friendship with China is overstated as well. Vietnam tries to avoid this conflict, but it's last nation China fought with (including at sea) in the first place.

For any more remote and offensive activity, say, convoys to forward bases, or supplies to offensive amphibious operations, everything applies even more.
Seeing India as friendly to China is also an overstatement. Few things unite indian politics, but hostility and suspicion to China is definitely one.

Also, I don't agree that submarine attack as a *low end attack*. Neither with cruise missiles, nor with heavyweight torpedoes(which are the deadliest and most sure weapon in modern naval warfare in the first place).

Iron Man said:

BTW I don't see any reason it couldn't handle a LRASM or two, not that it would even be exposed to such a threat in the first place. Philippines, Singapore, India, Indonesia, etc. don't have this missile and are not inclined to attack China in the first place.

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If you spot them in time - yes, no problem, they aren't that difficult as targets per se(though 054a close range options aren't very good). However, you aren't working with a very aware combatant here, even for normal ASCMs. And LRASMs are especially easy to miss.

For example, USMC F-35 presence is more or less expected on Luzon. And this was published just a couple days ago:

This is just a part of general US TACAIR update; most strike fighter platforms there are getting LRASM or/and JSM capabilities(as well as finally get relevant harpoon integration); there was a just yesterday. Others already have it.

Finally, about B-21s. Not expecting them to attack within 1IC is also optimistic - what are they even for, then...