054/A FFG Thread II

tphuang

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I've just read a Defense Industry Daily article about India's Project 17A stealth frigate (
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), and it got me thinking.
Really how... effective is the 054/054A in comparison to future frigates?
The Project 17A frigate will supposedly have a towed array sonar, which we haven't confirmed if the 054/054A has yet.
The Project 17A "ship “signature reduction” levels are expected to be up to fully modern standards, similar to Singapore’s new Formidable Class frigates from France". The 054A's RCS and signature reduction levels - are they as good as the La Fayette class?
Because while the 054A is a really good frigate, is it good enough for the future?
Or will we be seeing a 054B anytime soon with bigger signature reduction than the current 054A?
First, 054/A all have TAS, that's confirmed.

now, they are basically shelling out $10 billion for 7 ships, meaning 1.4 billion per ship. Each 054A costs slightly more than $200 million. So, for the cost of one Project 17A, you get to purchase 7 054A. Okay, so that's a little unfair, since there are other 054A costs like development of weapon systems that is not factored in here and we don't know if the Project 17A cost includes all of the subsystems although I presume it does for such a high cost. Even factor in inflation + extra program cost of 054A, each Project 17A ship will probably still cost at least as much as 5 054A.

But either way, IN is shelling out an astronomical amount for this ship. And if you looked at the proposed displacement, it's going to be bigger than 054A or even Project 17. It's more likely going to be closer to the displacement of FREMM (really depends on who is chosen). So, it should be expected that 054A is not going to be as good as Project 17A. In fact, considering the high cost of Project 17, 054A's cost to performance ratio is amazing when you consider that it's probably as good as Project 17 while built on like 1/3 of the cost.

As for stealth, who knows how stealthy Project 17A will be. If I don't see the ship, how can I judge stealth? But I would say that 054A isn't as stealthy as some of the recent lo ships like FREMM, Horizon or Formidable.
 

Baibar of Jalat

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Bltizo

Since India is committed to move 60,000 troops to disputed border, it is important to take note of capabilities of Indian Navy. However, ship stealth is not as advanced as plane stealth. Thus as Lando said not as invisiable (radar) as people think when referring to stealth.
 
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druid84

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The O54 A is truly a beautiful ship, one of my favourites. Based on what I have been reading on Indian news sites, the cost of the Indian P17A, some of the $1.4billion is meant for upgrades to Indian shipyards, since they need alot of help to handle modern/modular construction techniques. not for the ship itself. So the $1.4billion tag per ship should be taken with a grain of salt.
 

Skywatcher

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Isn't it a bit unreasonable to comparable Project 17A to Type 054A, due to their different weight classes? It's like comparing the LCA Tejas with the J-10.
 

Blitzo

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Well 054A on Sinodefence is 4500 tonnes, the Shivalik class is 4600 (standard). Therefore it wouldn't be that out there to say P17A will be somewhere around that mark.
So it's not really that unreasonable..

(Are you saying that the P17A is light or the Type 054A is light? If the former than I stand with what I said lol)
 

tphuang

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Well 054A on Sinodefence is 4500 tonnes, the Shivalik class is 4600 (standard). Therefore it wouldn't be that out there to say P17A will be somewhere around that mark.
So it's not really that unreasonable..

(Are you saying that the P17A is light or the Type 054A is light? If the former than I stand with what I said lol)

They say the maximum displacement of 054A is 4053, but I think it could be more than that because the 052B/C figures looked low and inconsistent. But if we go by the SDF figure of 1ength and width of the ship, it is slightly smaller than Shivalik. Project 17A is supposed to be larger than Project 17, so it will be larger than 054A (and not just a trivial size difference).
 

Blitzo

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"and not just a trivial size difference"

Could you please elaborate on that part?
 

Skywatcher

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I wonder how China only managed to pay 250 million USD for each Type 054A?

If the Project 17A keeps on expanding in size, the IN will have to decided between it or the Project 15, as Feng has pointed out on his blog.
 

Wolverine

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I wonder how China only managed to pay 250 million USD for each Type 054A?

US pays only 1 billion for its Arleigh Burke destroyers. Of course once you put in ammo, fuel, food, etc., the total price doubles. It's probably that way for the 054A's price too.
 

tphuang

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US pays only 1 billion for its Arleigh Burke destroyers. Of course once you put in ammo, fuel, food, etc., the total price doubles. It's probably that way for the 054A's price too.

what the heck are you talking about? It has all to do with shipbuilding being very efficient in China + using all domestically developed equipments -> cheap.

"and not just a trivial size difference"

Could you please elaborate on that part?
well, just look at fremm class, you can put Aster 30 there. Can you do that on 054A?
 
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