054/A FFG Thread II

[adeptitus]

Considering the size/displacement and cost of maintaining such large warships, it's unlikely that they'd be converted to CG service.

The 052 was a technology demonstrator with imported systems, and the 051B was the oddball black sheep used for PR. Both served their original purpose but those roles have been replaced by newer ships today. It'd be logical to assume that after refits, these ships will serve in secondary roles in the Navy until retirement. But the PLAN really doesn't have that many large displacement warships to spare for "secondary" roles in home waters. After the 2011 refit, both 052's have been deployed to Somalia, most recently Harbin DDG-112.

Also, the Chinese Navy simply doesn't have enough frigates to retire all the 053 class ships today. I'd expect the Jianghu V and Jiangwei I/II's to continue serving for years to come, though the Jiangwei class with aviation facility would actually make them superior choice for conversion & CG service.

 

[Jeff Head]

Sov is the only non Chinese platform, meaning lots of system are not very compatible with current PLAN mainstream.

But now is a very different times, I bet a Type054A is even more combat efficient than Sov with her Type 730 CWIS and VLS capable of multiple air engagement and anti sub rocket.

While Sov is essentially what CMS lacks to challenge Japan coast guard. I bet decomission Sov will help PLAN save more money in maintenace when compare to a Type054A frigate with most of the sub system remove except the radar and helo pad/hangar still needed.

I am very familiar with the Sovs, when they were purchased, and why.

To this day they are still very strong and effective surface combatants.

They have a very strong anti-surface capability designed to hit large enemy vessels, which is what they were designed to do. They have decent medium to short range anti-air, and a good capability with the helo for recon, OTH targeting, and ASW.

In company with a Type 052C or a Type 054A, they would make a strong part of any SAG and would be far too powerful for CG duties. There are four of them and several other PLAN vessels (like the two 052Bs, two 051Cs, etc.) with numerous systems and sensors that are the same or very similar. This means their logistical and maintenance issue is not in bad shape.

I can almost predict 100% that they will not be used for coast guard or civilian maritime duties.

 

[joshuatree]

As a few have already posted, there's a whole bunch of older 037s, 053s, and 051s to be decommissioned before the Sovs will be targeted for removal. Once the three types listed above have been liquidated or re-purposed should the attention then be turned towards the Sovs.

 

[steve_rolfe]

I keep reading posts from time to time where people discuss that the Chinese Navy will soon dispose of the Sov's for various reasons.
But i dont think this will be the case....certainly for the last 2 improved versions of the class.........remember these ships were only commissioned a few years ago ie 2005 & 2006..........surely they will be updated as best as possible to conform with the latest Chinese electronic systems of weapons control, radar etc, and should still be around even after 2020, when they still will be only 15 years old!

While the other Destroyers in the Chinese Navy are mainly AAW. The Sov's possess a formidible anti-ship capability.

I read somewhere, that the Sov's were designed to be able to create absolute mayhem, on an opposing surface fleet, by launching a blistering anti-ship attack........though it was suggested that the Sov's may not in return have a great survivabilty resistance against concerted counter attack if its opening assault did not render the opposing ships defenceless!

 

[franco-russe]

Not to forget that the SOVREMENNYY’s have the most powerful gun armament of any ship in the Chinese Navy. That is of course part of the anti-surface capability, but in particular highly relevant for shore bombardment which is principally the role they were designed for.

They will serve out their 30 years. No one would wish to use these expensive-to-operate for ocean patrol duties.

You will find the 051’s, 053’s and 037’s disappearing from PLAN’s inventory surprisingly fast:

With the exception of 165-166 and possibly 109-110, the few remaining LUDA’s will soon be replaced by 052C/D.

JIANGHU I is all but gone (516 remaining as fire support ship and 519 as test vessel). The six remaining JIANGHU II’s will usefully serve out their time as Nansha patrol frigates.

JIANGHU III will be down to one when 535-536 are handed over to Bangladesh.

JIANGHU V are quite decent ships after their modernisation and may remain until about 2025.

The HAINAN’s will go fast as they are being replaced by 056’s.

 

[MwRYum]

As a few have already posted, there's a whole bunch of older 037s, 053s, and 051s to be decommissioned before the Sovs will be targeted for removal. Once the three types listed above have been liquidated or re-purposed should the attention then be turned towards the Sovs.

China will eventually sort out its current logistical nightmare of fielding such a wide array of ships and equipment that span several generations and makes, but before the Sovremenny class DDG lined up for replacements, the PLAN will first have to replace a lot of other ships.

037s, 053s and 051 Luda series are being replaced by 056 and 054A (051 supposed to be DDG but by dimensions and capabilities its dwarfed by the 054A FFG); for DDGs there're the 051B/C, the two 052 and probably even the 052B...in short, DDG designs built during the "catching-up phase", those with just 1 or 2 boats per design built, are targets for replacement.

If and when the 052Bs are replaced (which in loadout terms is Sovremenny minus the Moskit missiles), Sovremenny's usefulness will be close to the end.

 

[Franklin]

China still has 16 Type 053 Jianghu's and 10 Type 051 Luda's in her fleet. Those will have to go first. That is 26 out of the 70 DDG and FFG in service in the PLAN today. Meaning that atleast 1/3 of China's current DDG and FFG fleet is obsolete. Next up will be the 14 2500 ton Type 053H2/3 Jiangwei's. Only then can China start thinking about decommissioning the Sovs and the other between types like the Type 052B. So those ships will be serving way beyond 2020.

This year we can still expect 2 more Type 054A's and atleast 1 more Type 052C to join the fleet and perhabs another 8 Type 056 corvettes.

 

[steve_rolfe]

China still has 16 Type 053 Jianghu's and 10 Type 051 Luda's in her fleet. Those will have to go first. That is 26 out of the 70 DDG and FFG in service in the PLAN today. Meaning that atleast 1/3 of China's current DDG and FFG fleet is obsolete. Next up will be the 14 2500 ton Type 053H2/3 Jiangwei's. Only then can China start thinking about decommissioning the Sovs and the other between types like the Type 052B. So those ships will be serving way beyond 2020.

This year we can still expect 2 more Type 054A's and atleast 1 more Type 052C to join the fleet and perhabs another 8 Type 056 corvettes.

I agree..................the Chinese have plenty of older ships to clear out first, before they even get around to the 'Sovs'.

By 2020 though, the Chinese fleet though, not increased probably in overall numbers, will instead have a relatively young very sophisticated fleet of home built warships with a high level of compatability between ships of weapons and electronic systems.

 

[mr.bean]

I am very familiar with the Sovs, when they were purchased, and why.

To this day they are still very strong and effective surface combatants.

They have a very strong anti-surface capability designed to hit large enemy vessels, which is what they were designed to do. They have decent medium to short range anti-air, and a good capability with the helo for recon, OTH targeting, and ASW.

In company with a Type 052C or a Type 054A, they would make a strong part of any SAG and would be far too powerful for CG duties. There are four of them and several other PLAN vessels (like the two 052Bs, two 051Cs, etc.) with numerous systems and sensors that are the same or very similar. This means their logistical and maintenance issue is not in bad shape.

I can almost predict 100% that they will not be used for coast guard or civilian maritime duties.

i totally agree that the Sov's will never be transferred to coast guard agencies because it's simply not fit for the role. they are heavily armed warships built for fighting in the open seas. it would be a waste of resources to use them for coast guard duty when these purpose built cutters can do it better in a cost effective manner. it's like driving a rig to the mall to do family shopping when a minivan would be the best choice.

 

[tphuang]

China still has 16 Type 053 Jianghu's and 10 Type 051 Luda's in her fleet. Those will have to go first. That is 26 out of the 70 DDG and FFG in service in the PLAN today. Meaning that atleast 1/3 of China's current DDG and FFG fleet is obsolete. Next up will be the 14 2500 ton Type 053H2/3 Jiangwei's. Only then can China start thinking about decommissioning the Sovs and the other between types like the Type 052B. So those ships will be serving way beyond 2020.

This year we can still expect 2 more Type 054A's and atleast 1 more Type 052C to join the fleet and perhabs another 8 Type 056 corvettes.

they definitely don't have that many jianghu in service and all of them will be retired soon. But, PLAN is definitely not ready to transfer Sov to coast guard in the near future. The first two Sovs will probably retire at around the same type as Type 052.