054/A FFG Thread II

[no_name]

I heard that the US had one DDX under construction and two more on order. Were they constructed in the same two shipyards?

 

[kwaigonegin]

I heard that the US had one DDX under construction and two more on order. Were they constructed in the same two shipyards?

answer is no.. seperate shipyards
FYI:

DDG 1000 USS Zumwalt / Under Construction
Commissioning: June 2014
Shipbuilder/s:Bath Iron Works

DDG 1001 USS Michael Monsoor / Under Construction
Commissioning: December 2015
Shipbuilder/s:Northrop Grumman

DDG 1002 / Under Construction
Commissioning: February 2018

when launch this class of destroyer will have no equal anywhere in the world.

....on a side note below is the latest development on the class...

US Navy Successfully Conducts DDG 1000's LRLAP Round Testing
Released on Thursday, September 22, 2011

WHITE SANDS, N.M. (NNS) -- The long range land attack projectile (LRLAP), designed for the DDG 1000 Advanced Gun System, successfully completed two live-fire tests at the White Sands Missile Range in New Mexico, the Navy announced Sept. 22.

The mission, conducted Aug. 30, was the first live-fire test to successfully demonstrate LRLAP effectiveness against targets.

LRLAP is a 155 millimeter rocket-assisted guided projectile designed to support land-attack and naval surface fire support operations in conjunction with the Advanced Gun System on DDG 1000-class destroyers.

Both flight tests flew 45 nautical miles and met key test objectives including successful launch, GPS acquisition, warhead functionality, and terminal accuracy.

 

[plawolf]

The DDG1000 reminds me of the oldschool ironclads of early steam power in it's profile and mission. Going a little full circle I guess.

 

[Jeff Head]

I heard that the US had one DDX under construction and two more on order. Were they constructed in the same two shipyards?

All of the Zumwalts will be built at Bath Iron Works in Maine. Afterwards, Bath will begin on more Burke's, probably the new Flight III version. See below for documentation.

answer is no.. seperate shipyards
FYI:

DDG 1000 USS Zumwalt / Under Construction
Commissioning: June 2014
Shipbuilder/s:Bath Iron Works

DDG 1001 USS Michael Monsoor / Under Construction
Commissioning: December 2015
Shipbuilder/s:Northrop Grumman

DDG 1002 / Under Construction
Commissioning: February 2018.

This is incorrect. All Zumwalts will be built (and are being built) at Bath Iron Works. DDG 1000 and DDG 1001 are arleady under construction. DDG 1002 to follow at Bath.

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Bath currently has contracts to build all three of the next-generation Zumwalt destroyers, and was awarded $1.8 billion earlier this month for the final two ships in that production run.

See also:

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Also...

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On 6 April 2009, Defense Secretary Robert Gates announced that DoD's proposed 2010 budget will end the DDG-1000 program at a maximum of three ships. Also in April, the Pentagon awarded a fixed-price contract with General Dynamics to build the three destroyers, replacing a cost-plus-fee contract that had been awarded to Northrop Grumman. All three destroyers will be built in Maine at Bath Iron works though sub-assemly work will occur at various other locations.

 

[tphuang]

One can't simply compare the production rate of PLAN destroyer/FFG runs vs USN's AB's rate.

Ingalls and Bath's turns out 2/year each and that;s taken their substantial production capacity.
while HP, JN, HD, and DaLian only dedicate a (I would say small) part of their capacity to build naval vessels.
rests of capacity are for high value added commercial ships like VLCC, LNG carriers and Oil platforms etc. which are no less complex than destroyers.

hmm, the military ships are pretty much more complex than most of those civilian ships that the Chinese shipyard build.

they are all big and profitable commerical yards.

now if HD, JN, HP would devote a higher percentage of their capacity to building destroyers. and may be some other "smaller" yards would get in the action also, I believe at least in rate China would have no problem matching US rates.

How fast they were putting together the 022 productions runs in their secondary yards is an indication of that potential capacity.
Now the first type 056 is laid down, we shall see how many of these secondary yards will get into action.
rumor has it that many of the contractors are smaller yards the productions runs is about as twice as big as 054's . we shall see.

not just capacity. The larger factor are funding and fleet size. PLAN does have finite funding and I don't think they should spend more. Since Chinese economy is about to face some difficulties ahead, it shouldn't overspend on military. Also, you need to the software to go with the hardware. They need to train qualified sailors for these ships, but that takes time and a lot of money.

I believe the Type054A will run a little further...who knows how long, and who knows what changes they will make. But it is indicative of the trend in the PLAN's building capability. Hats off to them for prodicung these capable, mulit-role FFGs so quickly.

More 52Cs are being built as we speak, and more 071 LPDs. All are strong combatants in their roles and mark a significant improvement for the PLAN.

There is talk of a total of 75 Burkes now, the last 10 or so being a bridge cruiser design in excess of 10,000 tons in displacement. We're anxious to see what that design might hold if they go through with it.

If you look at 054A, it's already had a very long production run. There were only 14 Jiangwei, so 054A will already exceed that. I think if it was not for 054A's performance in Gulf of Aden, these ships that we see now will probably be the last ones. But instead, we will see a few more coming out.

PLAN really has no need to have that many powerful ships like Burke at this point. It just needs to expand within the constraint of funding and crew training in mind.

 

[A.Man]

The 8th 054A of Huangpu?

 

[sealordlawrence]

I think we have seen that scene before. There is more than one boat in parts there.

 

[i.e.]

hmm, the military ships are pretty much more complex than most of those civilian ships that the Chinese shipyard build.

not just capacity. The larger factor are funding and fleet size. PLAN does have finite funding and I don't think they should spend more. Since Chinese economy is about to face some difficulties ahead, it shouldn't overspend on military. Also, you need to the software to go with the hardware. They need to train qualified sailors for these ships, but that takes time and a lot of money.

.

Oil Platforms and Gas Carriers are pretty complex machines demanding pretty exacting standards of work.
Chinese ship building industry was able to only crack the Gas carrier market about 10 years ago.

we are discussing capacity not funding, no one has infinite funding.
also in time of war those civilian yards may not churn out complex machines, but prob is able to churn out dumb down versions of frigates and destroyers and simply flood the fleet...Most of US ship building industry pre-WW2 was also pretty low tech. once they ramped up during WW2 they did fine.

btw, the new 056 light frigates will be built mostly by these "secondary" lowtech civilian yards. they will replace 037 in the fleet.

simply able to churn out a massive number of 056 sized light frigates is very useful in time of war.

 

[plawolf]

Really depends on the nature of the war. Unless WWIII breaks out, no-one is going to be converting civilian shipyards to spam warships. Even existing military yards would probably not be able to turn out new warships quick enough to get in on the action of most wars, most certainly not for things like FFGs and DDGs.

If China was to start spaming a type in response to war, it would be the 022s anyways.

In terms of modern warfare, the ability to rapidly crank up production of weapons like missiles and bombs would be far far more critical that being able to build new warships. That is where the truth strength of America and China lies, especially compared to those who reply heavily on imported munitions.

 

[tphuang]

Oil Platforms and Gas Carriers are pretty complex machines demanding pretty exacting standards of work.
Chinese ship building industry was able to only crack the Gas carrier market about 10 years ago.

That's why I said most of them, not all of them.

we are discussing capacity not funding, no one has infinite funding.
also in time of war those civilian yards may not churn out complex machines, but prob is able to churn out dumb down versions of frigates and destroyers and simply flood the fleet...Most of US ship building industry pre-WW2 was also pretty low tech. once they ramped up during WW2 they did fine.

what's the point of this? Are we thinking about war already? Nobody is questioning Chinese shipyard capacity here. The question is why would they need to build that many ships? PLAN shouldn't get itself involved in any kind of arms race with difficulties ahead for its economy.

btw, the new 056 light frigates will be built mostly by these "secondary" lowtech civilian yards. they will replace 037 in the fleet.

simply able to churn out a massive number of 056 sized light frigates is very useful in time of war.

depends on what conflict. In any asymmetrical warfare with USN, 022 would be far more cost effective. 056 isn't going to have more firepower than 022, but it would have longer range to do patrols. It will be more useful in South China Sea for example and will replace a lot of the 037s and Jianghus.