052/052B Class Destroyers

Asymptote

Asymptote

Banned Idiot
Re: DDG 052C Thread

Maggern said:
As already mentioned, it is the problem of the impossibility of being best in all areas. Let's say you get a fixed hull that you could configure any way you wanted. You could churn out a bunch of them with a mix of the basic stuff of all mission types. But if the enemy then came along with the same hull, although wholly configured for anti-ship warfare, it would have a huge advantage over your ships.

The solution would be to increase the hull size. Larger hull=more sensors, more weapon systems etc. But then you have the problem of a rapidly increasing size of propulsion units and proportionally less maneuverability. A huge, lumbering, heavily loaded ship would easily be taken out by a bunch of small, agile ships. And you can't use carrier-sized ships racing around chasing subs either. Of course, if the enemy could force you to use such a huge and important ship to chase some speedboat or dwarf submarine, he would have the upper hand in any case.
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I see, that's quite succinct and to the point. Thanks!

What you suggesting, made me think of this scenario in the future:
What about a swarm of smaller, highly agile, highly specialized surface combatants?? Maybe something as small as the Type 022 Houbei class missile boat? ofcourse I know Type 022 is a littoral combat ship not fit for blue water operation, what I mean is the size that's similar to Type 022 but fit for blue water operation. With networked centric warfare now part of the new push in all area of military tech, a swarm based attack paradigm seems to the logical conclusion.
 
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no_name

Colonel
Re: DDG 052C Thread

I think the problem is that to carry those Type-022 sized boats (who on their own would never have enough range for blue water operation), you would need a fairly big sized mothership, which would call for escorts and support ships.

In which case you would probably be better off just have a carrier group. There is pretty much nothing that the heli and planes onboard the carrier cannot do that a type 022 can, and they will likely do it faster too.
 
Blitzo

Blitzo

Lieutenant General
Staff member
Super Moderator
Registered Member
Re: DDG 052C Thread

no_name said:
I think the problem is that to carry those Type-022 sized boats (who on their own would never have enough range for blue water operation), you would need a fairly big sized mothership, which would call for escorts and support ships.

In which case you would probably be better off just have a carrier group. There is pretty much nothing that the heli and planes onboard the carrier cannot do that a type 022 can, and they will likely do it faster too.
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FACs in blue water is a stupid idea, they will be sitting ducks for helicopters or fighters in the open sea even if they were very very stealthy.
 
D

delft

Brigadier
Re: DDG 052C Thread

Maggern said:
As for the concrete examples of attempts to make a one-size-fits-all (i.e. JSF among others) the problems of being possibly beaten in all circumstances (by specialized aircraft), in these cases this fact is outweighed by greatly increased efficiency in training and maintenance (as well as production)
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Or not, as the case may be.

For ships there is another point. A larger ship needs for going a certain distance with a certain speed a weight of the propulsion plant plus weight of fuel that is a smaller part of the whole ship weight than for a smaller vessel. So she can carry a larger crew in more comfort and carry more food &c, for them, giving so a longer endurance.
So a larger ship is better, but for the arguments mentioned above in this thread to the contrary. Just as in nature, a varied ecosystem is better than a mono culture.
 
A

A.Man

Major
Re: DDG 052C Thread

You Can See Them Both On One Photo Now

2566e32ae722b3977c6.jpg
 
F

franco-russe

Senior Member
Re: DDG 052C Thread

Thanks a lot for this rather unique panorama of Jiangnan Changxing shipyard (as well as for the equally unique pre-launch photo posted with # 451). They give a much better understanding of the yard’s layout than does the GE image. The views of the launch basin are particularly valuable.

We actually see three newbuildings: WOZANG Hull 2 and 052C+ Hull 1 fitting out, plus 052C+ Hull 2 protruding from Building Hall 1, where it was moved from its original position in Hall 2, next to the minehunter.
 
cn_habs

cn_habs

Junior Member
Re: DDG 052C Thread

Sczepan said:
once more
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This is by far the closest and the most conclusive pic of the new 052C + right now. It's 100% confirmed that the it's still the same cold launched revolver HQ-9. chances are that there are still only 48 (6x8) of them. :(
 
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tanlixiang28776

Junior Member
Re: DDG 052C Thread

cn_habs said:
This is by far the closest and the most conclusive pic of the new 052C + right now. It's 100% confirmed that the it's still the same cold launched revolver HQ-9. chances are that there are still only 48 (6x8) of them. :(
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Its still a very powerful ship you know. We fanboys have been spoiled rotten lately.
 
MwRYum

MwRYum

Major
Re: DDG 052C Thread

cn_habs said:
This is by far the closest and the most conclusive pic of the new 052C + right now. It's 100% confirmed that the it's still the same cold launched revolver HQ-9. chances are that there are still only 48 (6x8) of them. :(
Click to expand...

If they aim to have a taskgroup on-call at any one time, increase the number of 052 to 4 ships would be the fastest, sensible and sure-fire way to do it. Sure it ain't ideal candidate but everything is test and tried, plus PLAN strategy is always solve the "have-it" part of the problem first, then deal with the "refine" part of the problem.

Or they reconciled that the 054A frigates can shoulder part of the air-defense mission, so the current 052 design is good enough, at least for now.
 
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