The War in the Ukraine

LawLeadsToPeace

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Shadow_Whomel

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It was earlier speculated locally in Kiev that Russian missiles hit the GUR headquarters facility of the General Intelligence Directorate of the UKR Defense Ministry on the 28th: Ukrainian media reported that the Gavinsky Bridge, which connects the "Fisherman's Peninsula," was closed to traffic after the missile strike, and that the "Fisherman's Peninsula" is where the GUR headquarters is located. Now satellite photos confirm that GUR HQ was hit.

0084Nct6ly1hehi52t3p6j30kp0or7c6.jpg0084Nct6ly1hehi530asmj30jq0p4t9z.jpg
 

Anlsvrthng

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It is a bit ridiculous to me, to simply claim that either system has an inferior radar system without mentioning any relevant specs. I'm not going to claim that Patriot is the superior system, but based on its age, size, and US extensive history and experience at crafting radar systems, I find it highly unlikely that United States cannot build a system with a superior radar than what USSR's mid 80s MIC was capable of.

Unless somebody wants to provide some actual facts, the claim that either system is better is largely unsubstantiated.
Your argument revolving around : " our 120 mm artirelly is superior their 152 mm ones, because the magic touch".

There are basic characteristic, like size and power.

You can try to recover the disadvantage of a small and weak radar by spending huge ammount of money, but in the case of Patriot we can't talk about that even.


And again, Ukraine had comparable/as big radar + SAM inventory as the USA in 2021. And Russia has way bigger. So , which party could have more experience in building compact radar systems ?

I suggest to check the number of deployed SAM batteries around the world.

And the difference in quality of radar systems won't end here .
Example, a simple S-300 battery has better radar set than a Zumwalt, considering the later hasn't received the multiband (S+X) package due to cost constraints
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The first shipborn USA radar (NOT compact , land transportable) will be in the FUTURE destroyers, NOT in production yet ,but development phase.
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What are you talking about ? Faith and illusions ?

The first USA destroyer will get the capability of the first generation, 1980s vintage S-300 units in the coming years. If there is no Ford or F35 like catastropics cost and schedule overrun.

Maybe hard to cope, but the Ukrainan , 1980s vintage radars and SAM system capabilites can't be matched with the latest deployed USA land or shipborn systems.
 

Right_People

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Is there any evidence that VKS air defence was ever deployed in Ukraine (excluding Crimea)? From what I’ve seen, only ground forces air defence are actually present in Ukraine.
The ground forces no longer operate any SAMs under their control, everything passed under the control of the VKS a few months ago.
This was one of the measures taken to reduce the recurrent losses of aircraft to friendly forces ...
 

HighGround

Senior Member
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Your argument revolving around : " our 120 mm artirelly is superior their 152 mm ones, because the magic touch".

There are basic characteristic, like size and power.

You can try to recover the disadvantage of a small and weak radar by spending huge ammount of money, but in the case of Patriot we can't talk about that even.


And again, Ukraine had comparable/as big radar + SAM inventory as the USA in 2021. And Russia has way bigger. So , which party could have more experience in building compact radar systems ?

I suggest to check the number of deployed SAM batteries around the world.

And the difference in quality of radar systems won't end here .
Example, a simple S-300 battery has better radar set than a Zumwalt, considering the later hasn't received the multiband (S+X) package due to cost constraints
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
The first shipborn USA radar (NOT compact , land transportable) will be in the FUTURE destroyers, NOT in production yet ,but development phase.
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

What are you talking about ? Faith and illusions ?

The first USA destroyer will get the capability of the first generation, 1980s vintage S-300 units in the coming years. If there is no Ford or F35 like catastropics cost and schedule overrun.

Maybe hard to cope, but the Ukrainan , 1980s vintage radars and SAM system capabilites can't be matched with the latest deployed USA land or shipborn systems.

That’s a lot of statements with no specifics.

How big is the AN/MPQ-65? How big is it? How many radar elements? How much power? What resolution and accuracy is it capable of?

How does it compare to the S-300 Surveillance and Tracking radar?
 

obj 705A

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At least one dead in Ukrainian attack on shelter for displaced in Russia​


A shelter housing temporarily displaced people came under heavy artillery shelling in Russia’s southwestern Belgorod Region on Wednesday. The attack killed a security guard and gravely injured two of its residents, local governor Vyacheslav Gladkov has said.

The facility, which used to be a recreation center before the beginning of the hostilities between Russia and Ukraine, housed residents of Sereda – a small village near the Ukrainian border. The village’s residents ended up displaced over a year ago and have been living at the shelter ever since, according to Gladkov, who visited the location shortly after the incident to assess the damage.

The housing and an administrative building suffered three direct hits, the governor wrote in a Telegram post, sharing photos from the scene. The attack heavily damaged the buildings, while two road vehicles got pelted with fragments.

Over the course of the ongoing conflict, Belgorod, as well as other Russian regions bordering Ukraine, have been subjected to repeated artillery, rocket, and drone attacks. The Ukrainian attacks have primarily affected residential areas, prompting the evacuation of multiple settlements along the border.

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_______________________________________

Russian civilians in Belgorod being killed and injured is nothing new, several months ago entire towns in Belgorod were already destroyed by the Ukrainians and it's people were displaced and now the AFU is further targeting those who have been displaced.

One of the basic missions of a military is to protect the people of it's country within it's borders, it's very weird to see the supposed third strongest military in the world fail at this basic mission.

The logical thing to do here is for Russia to occupy parts of the Kharkov and Sumy oblasts so as to turn them into buffer zones. The fact that after several months of Belgorod being shelled the Russians have yet to do that means the Russians either lack the political will or they actualy lack the military capability to do so. If it's the former then that would be pretty weird because what would that mean? that Putin is just not in the mood to protect his people?

Several months ago a member of Russia's Duma said there is massive media cover up from the Russian side to hide the extent of destruction that happened to the Russian towns near the border due to AFU shelling. one or two Russian citizens being killed every now and then may not seem like much but over the course of a year this starts to add up, I wonder how many total Russian citizens have been killed in Belgorod since the start of the war!
 

Anlsvrthng

Captain
Registered Member
That’s a lot of statements with no specifics.

How big is the AN/MPQ-65? How big is it? How many radar elements? How much power? What resolution and accuracy is it capable of?

How does it compare to the S-300 Surveillance and Tracking radar?
rad.jpg

See ,mate , I try to explain the elements of the above radar equation.

The Pt and Pmin could be claimed as "magic invisible sauce" , the gain and the wavelength is simply parameter of the antenna.
No magic sauce here .
Now, we can go into the details of the Gain
gain.jpg

If we jump back to the original equation, and replace the G with the full function then we will get the waelength canceled out in the divident , get a lambda sqaure in the divisor , and the antenna size and efficiency in the divident , both on sqare.

MEans doubling the antenna size and efficiency (geometrical tolerances during manufacturing) will yield 16 times bigger result ,but increase the power doublefold, and increase the sensitivity doublefold increase the overal performance only four times.


See, magic sauce doesn't have too much effect.

And reminder :
30N6-vs-MPQ-53-A.jpg


64N6-vs-SPY-1-A.jpg

How could be spelled more ways: The USA patriots in Kiev has inferrior performacne compared to the S-300 that they had ?

Ukraine needs 2-6times more patriot than S-300 to stay in the game.
 
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