177S recently revealed in Zhuhai air show has 6000 hours service life.. which consider highly reliable. can be comparable to modern western Engines.
Indian Military News, Reports, Data, etc.
- Thread starter bd popeye
- Start date
India allegedly had its own RD-33MK production line, so it shouldn't be as much of an issue if there is anything left of it.
Well. F404 is objectively a more modern engine base than RD-33, especially since RD-33 was designed for austere field use, which is the last thing light multirole fighter (badly dependent on p:w and fuel use) needs.
But RD-33, for all it's relative "reds" in comparison(and there is a lot), is, 1st, good enough. And it's reliably available. Not considering which after quite recent american sanctions back in late 1990s was something in-between criminal neglect of duty and very real treason.
Furthermore, 2nd. it's absolutely legal to take RD-33 in any direction you need, which both Russia, and more importantly, China did. RD-33 is kinda meh? Sure. Didn't prevent WS-13/WS-19/WS-21 line (which, it appears, is more succesful that WS-15, despite later start and likely lower priority - speaking about "bad base") from emerging.
Lethe
Captain
So far as I can see there are no official, specific claims made about the readiness of the birds pictured. The lack of engines is hardly surprising and is not a HAL problem, but a GE problem that is in the process of being resolved. The question is if we will actually see deliveries of Mk. 1A aircraft ramp up as those engines arrive, or if other bottlenecks remain. Suggestive in that respect are the comments from Air Chief Marshal AP Singh six months ago at Aero India 2025, where he said that HAL was falling short on Mk. 1A production irrespective of the engine issue: (switch to original audio track).
India doesn't want to become overly reliant upon Russia any more than it wants to become overly reliant upon the United States or any other single vendor nation. That more than 300 Su-30MKI and MiG-29 aircraft currently comprise the bulk of IAF combat airpower has dampened the prospects for further recent and near-term acquisitions of Russian hardware. F404 has been attached to the LCA project for forty years now, well before EJ200 or M88 were viable options. That it survived the experience of the Pokhran II sanctions is both remarkable and questionable, but it did.
For LCA Mk. 2 in particular, alternative engine prospects are also constrained by the weight control issues ADA has had with LCA to date, and the increased range/payload/equipment levels that are targeted for Mk. 2. As such, LCA in both its Mk. 1A and Mk. 2 variants needs as much thrust as it can get, and F414 simply offers more than the other engines in its general weight class. When one considers how laborious each and every stage of the LCA project has proven to be, one can appreciate a reluctance to undertake the additional work that would be required to accommodate an alternative engine. Thus, absent a clear show-stopper like Washington actually embargoing the engines, the tendency is to push forward with the F404 and now F414 pathways on an incremental basis, i.e. progressing from the F404 as the developmental engine for LCA back when it was envisioned that GTRE's Kaveri engine would be powering production aircraft, to having F404 power the entire Mk. 1/1A production series.
India doesn't want to become overly reliant upon Russia any more than it wants to become overly reliant upon the United States or any other single vendor nation. That more than 300 Su-30MKI and MiG-29 aircraft currently comprise the bulk of IAF combat airpower has dampened the prospects for further recent and near-term acquisitions of Russian hardware. F404 has been attached to the LCA project for forty years now, well before EJ200 or M88 were viable options. That it survived the experience of the Pokhran II sanctions is both remarkable and questionable, but it did.
For LCA Mk. 2 in particular, alternative engine prospects are also constrained by the weight control issues ADA has had with LCA to date, and the increased range/payload/equipment levels that are targeted for Mk. 2. As such, LCA in both its Mk. 1A and Mk. 2 variants needs as much thrust as it can get, and F414 simply offers more than the other engines in its general weight class. When one considers how laborious each and every stage of the LCA project has proven to be, one can appreciate a reluctance to undertake the additional work that would be required to accommodate an alternative engine. Thus, absent a clear show-stopper like Washington actually embargoing the engines, the tendency is to push forward with the F404 and now F414 pathways on an incremental basis, i.e. progressing from the F404 as the developmental engine for LCA back when it was envisioned that GTRE's Kaveri engine would be powering production aircraft, to having F404 power the entire Mk. 1/1A production series.
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They also have an AL-31 line for their SU-MKI. If those were of any use, they should have had the Kaveri up and running after 4 decades.
They were never confident enough in the Kaveri to put it on fighter -- even for a test flight.
Al-31 is advanced Jet engine. How much of these production lines are actual production and how much is just assembling mostly finished parts?
If India can make an engine like AL-31 from start to finish, that is quite advanced. They can gain a lot of know-how. If Russia transferred technology to that extent then I would find it quite concerning to be honest.
