USS Guardian has run aground

bd popeye

bd popeye

The Last Jedi
VIP Professional
Hey AFB.. how's the weather in Obamastan? Snow day in Iowa! It's snowing heavily right now.

Yep .. This is hard to swallow..

In another forum a retired USN Captain wrote this about the fate of the Guardian.

As I've mentioned before, there are two mortal sins of commission that usually incur a career death penalty for a CO, and that is running a ship aground, and the other is colliding with another ship.

The fact that the digital charts had an eight mile error is definitely a mitigating circumstance. Let's assume that made the act of grounding "forgivable" for a minute. The next concern would be the conduct of the CO and his damage control team in the aftermath of the grounding. Here's where it gets dicey, and I don't like to comment without knowing more details, but there are a couple of things that must be done right away. It sounds counter-intuitive but you actually want to transfer as much ballast onto the portion of the hull that is actually aground as you can, and then the Damage Control Assistant will calculate "tons aground," as that is valuable data for salvors downstream, but it also creates a more favorable situation for that portion afloat to aid in the ship being towed off or floating free on it's own. More importantly, by weighting down that portion of the hull aground, you minimize the degree to which the wind and waves can buffet it and cause all the damage we've seen. The problem is, with a wooden hull, even covered in fiberglass, it's not designed like the steel hulled destroyers, cruisers and carriers with which I am most familiar that have numerous fuel and water tanks internal to the hull. In them you can move fuel and potable or boiler feed water around to get that weight where you need it in a hurry. With a small ship like this, and a wooden hull to boot, you don't have those options. So they'd have to move heavy items, etc. to accomplish the same thing. Whether any part of that was done will probably be the point of focus for a Board of Inquiry. It may not have helped even if they did.

Even if not found in any way culpable, promotion beyond Commander is probably not in the offing. It's the nature of the beast.
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Air Force Brat

Air Force Brat

Brigadier
Super Moderator
bd popeye said:
Hey AFB.. how's the weather in Obamastan? Snow day in Iowa! It's snowing heavily right now.

Yep .. This is hard to swallow..

In another forum a retired USN Captain wrote this about the fate of the Guardian.
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Yeah I love snow days, I was gone this AM we had a Thunderstorm last night and the alternator went out on our car coming home from the little girls volleyball game, I lost most of my lights and the engine died, I bumped started it and drove another 1/2 mile and as it started to die, I pulled off the road and the soft ditch pulled it right in. So I was pulling it out with my old Toyota Landcruiser this am, pulled her right out, it was warm, but your front just blew threw, LOL

Well you have to wonder who was minding the store on the Guardian, and to leave her there, and now to dismember her publicly, reminds me of the P-3 that landed on Hainen Island after being visited by an Interceptor, all normal until some little jockey decides to make it more interesting by flying his rudder through the prop arc, resulting in his and his aircrafts loss, and the near loss of the P-3C, which then landed on Hainen Island. My Dad was so angry when we dissmantled the P-3, his solution would have been to ..........................I think I'll shut up now, and moderate myself, call if you need to borrow the Land Cruiser, it loves snow, thanks for asking bd? Cheers Brat

Captains comments are interesting to say the least? Brat
 
kwaigonegin

kwaigonegin

Colonel
bd popeye said:
Hey AFB.. how's the weather in Obamastan? Snow day in Iowa! It's snowing heavily right now.

Yep .. This is hard to swallow..

In another forum a retired USN Captain wrote this about the fate of the Guardian.
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I find it perplexing that even with GPS, sonar and other modern technologies available there is still a +- 8 miles of error on navigational chart.!
 
J

joshuatree

Captain
kwaigonegin said:
I find it perplexing that even with GPS, sonar and other modern technologies available there is still a +- 8 miles of error on navigational chart.!
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Sounds like the human error occurred by over-relying on those digital charts. I'm sure there are other instruments telling the crew otherwise but it is up to them on listening to it or ignoring it.
 
D

delft

Brigadier
I wonder if the ship could have put anchors out into deeper water to prevent her being pushed further onto the reef. What anchors did she have, what boats did she have to do this. If, as the USN retired captain says, moving ballast would have been time consuming, this should have been very nearly the first task. Was it? If not, why not?
 
bd popeye

bd popeye

The Last Jedi
VIP Professional
Delft I wish I knew:(. I do not.. All your questions are very valid. Hopefully they and many others will be answered during the investigation into this grounding.
 
bd popeye

bd popeye

The Last Jedi
VIP Professional
Recent USN photos of the Guardian..

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SULU SEA (Jan. 26, 2013) Rigid-hull inflatable boats transfer cargo from the mine countermeasures ship USS Guardian (MCM 5) to the guided-missile destroyer USS Mustin (DDG 89), in background. Guardian ran aground on Tubbataha Reef Jan. 17. (U.S. Navy photod by Mass Communication Specialist 3rd Class Kelby Sanders/Released)
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SULU SEA (Jan. 27, 2013) U.S. Navy Sailors transfer cargo from the mine countermeasures ship USS Guardian (MCM 5) to rigid-hull inflatable boat as part of ongoing salvage efforts. Guardian ran aground on Tubbataha Reef Jan. 17. (U.S. Navy photo by Mass Communication Specialist 3rd Class Kelby Sanders/Released)
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SULU SEA (Jan. 29, 2013) Heavy waves crash against the grounded mine countermeasure ship USS Guardian (MCM 5), which ran aground on the Tubbataha Reef in the Sulu Sea on Jan. 17. The grounding and subsequent heavy waves constantly hitting Guardian have caused severe damage, leading the Navy to determine the 23-year old ship is beyond economical repair and is a complete loss. With the deteriorating integrity of the ship, the weight involved, and where it has grounded on the reef, dismantling the ship in sections is the only supportable salvage option. The U.S. Navy continues to work in close cooperation with the Philippine Coast Guard and Navy to safely dismantle Guardian from the reef while minimizing environmental effects. (U.S. Navy photo/Released)
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SULU SEA (Jan. 28, 2013) The U.S. Navy-contracted Malaysian tug Vos Apollo removes petroleum-based products and human wastewater from the mine countermeasure ship USS Guardian (MCM 5), which ran aground on the Tubbataha Reef in the Sulu Sea on Jan. 17. No fuel has leaked since the grounding and all of the approximately 15,000 gallons aboard Guardian was safely transferred to Vos Apollo during two days of controlled de-fueling operations. The grounding and subsequent heavy waves hitting Guardian have caused severe damage, leading the Navy to determine the 23-year old ship is beyond economical repair and is a complete loss. With the deteriorating integrity of the ship, the weight involved, and where it has grounded on the reef, dismantling the ship in sections is the only supportable salvage option. Since Guardian's grounding, the Navy has been working meticulously to salvage any reusable equipment, retrieve the crew's personal effects, and remove any potentially harmful materials. The U.S. Navy continues to work in close cooperation with the Philippine Coast Guard and Navy to safely dismantle Guardian from the reef while minimizing environmental effects. (U.S. Navy photo/Released)
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Jeff Head

Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
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