US F/A-XX and F-X & NGAD - 6th Gen Aircraft News Thread

[anzha]

What is the likelihood "The Committee" succeeds in getting the F/A-XX heavily funded to the detriment of other important programs?

I think people are missing a very classic move the US Navy does. It does it almost every year. It is annoying as fsck.

What am I talking about? The USN has a very ridiculous game where it zeroes out line items the Navy KNOWS Congress will fund. The navy says 'see what you made me do?!' A plethora of press comes out about how bad x or y is. The US can't do x or y or z. The world is ending and everything has changed. Whoa is the navy. whoa. Congress shrieks and hollers and provides the funding after scolding them thoroughly.

This has been going on for most of my adult life.

Let's wait and see if the program is actually delayed or cancelled before making massive declarations.

It may be massively delayed or outright cancelled (looking at you US army for the n^nth time). However, given what I've seen, best to wait.

 

[bebops]

F-47 will have revolutionary improvements in combat radius?

only possible if they install three new gen engines. Good radius requires higher power generation

China warship usually have 1 engine more than their US counterpart. j36 (3 engine) vs b21 (2 engine); f35 (1 engine) vs j20 and j35 ( 2 engine)

 

[SinoAmericanCW]

The U.S. seems to be increasingly in trouble:

 

[valysre]

j36 (3 engine) vs b21 (2 engine)

I think it's a bit disingenuous to cite this an example, considering one of the planes is capable of supersonic flight and the other one isn't.

 

[4Tran]

"U.S. officials say a key driver behind this decision is a fear that America’s industrial base cannot develop and produce two different advanced stealth fighters simultaneously."

So its official. They acknowledge that their industrial base may not be able to match that of their greatest rival, and so have pragmatically chosen to focus on a single 6th-gen fighter project rather than try two and fail at both.

The only headscratcher is why they've decided to focus on the USAF fighter and not the USN plane. America's lack of strategic depth in WESTPAC means that even if they had the best land-based fighter in the world, it would be hard-pressed to fight without safe bases where it can launch with combat loads. Having their only 6th-gen fighter be the Navy's carrier-borne mainstay makes sense, it being essentially an F-22 replacement that also cannot fight over the Pacific does not. Unless they really believe the F-47 will have revolutionary improvements in combat radius?

I think that prioritizing the F-47 makes sense. Its program is likely quite a bit further along and the US is in pretty desperate catch up mode right now. The other issue is that the White House and the Pentagon have deemed the Western Pacific as the most crucial battleground.

The problem is that it's so far away from the US that it's really hard to project power that far against someone that can fight back. Right now, the USMC and the Army are desperately trying to find a reason for their existence because they are useless in the Western Pacific. Even the USAF has a really tough time because the basing in the region is so poor that only a tiny portion of their fleet can be employed. The F-22 is their primary air superiority fighter but it has such short legs that it simply can't reach the battlefield. One of the most important features of the F-47 is that it's supposed to have a very long range. If it can do about 1000nm with a combat load, then it would be able to go from Guam to Taiwan with a single refuelling in between. It's not exactly an ideal solution but beggars can't be choosers.

In comparison, while the Navy is the most important arm, it already can send F-35s into the fight. Sure, having a better plane would be ideal but getting the USAF involved is more important. Still, this is not a promising development for the US. It increasing feels like they just can't make things any more.

 

[TK3600]

Didnt Trump approve F-50 twin engined "F-22 but better" aircraft? Airforce can just use that instead, and prioritize naval 6th gen. Naval 6th gen is their primary means of power projection, and the primary aircraft against China.

The F-50 can fulfill the defensive mission and is 'good enough' to fill the gap of F-15 for air patrol. Worst case just use F-35?

 

[4Tran]

Didnt Trump approve F-50 twin engined "F-22 but better" aircraft? Airforce can just use that instead, and prioritize naval 6th gen. Naval 6th gen is their primary means of power projection, and the primary aircraft against China.

The F-50 can fulfill the defensive mission and is 'good enough' to fill the gap of F-15 for air patrol. Worst case just use F-35?

I think that he just saw a picture of a J-35. I wouldn't take the "J-55" seriously at all. Although if it did exist, I'd imagine that the USN would be more interested in it than the USAF. The USN doesn't like the idea of flying single engine fighters.

 

[no_name]

"U.S. officials say a key driver behind this decision is a fear that America’s industrial base cannot develop and produce two different advanced stealth fighters simultaneously."

So its official. They acknowledge that their industrial base may not be able to match that of their greatest rival, and so have pragmatically chosen to focus on a single 6th-gen fighter project rather than try two and fail at both.

The only headscratcher is why they've decided to focus on the USAF fighter and not the USN plane. America's lack of strategic depth in WESTPAC means that even if they had the best land-based fighter in the world, it would be hard-pressed to fight without safe bases where it can launch with combat loads. Having their only 6th-gen fighter be the Navy's carrier-borne mainstay makes sense, it being essentially an F-22 replacement that also cannot fight over the Pacific does not. Unless they really believe the F-47 will have revolutionary improvements in combat radius?

Maybe Canada simply looked more attractive than China these days

Those carriers are eating DF-XXs anyway when SHTF.

 

[Kich]

I don't believe the claim the industry can't handle 2 fighter program at the same time, unless if Boeing had won both, which would be extremely stupid if that company was awarded both programs.

This is more likely that both programs can't be funded at the same time. Too many projects going on. Something will have to be axed; the SSBN, Golden Dome, nuclear modernization, Constellation, soon DDGX, etc.

@anzha is right. This is a preamble dance by DoD and Navy to get more funding for the F/A-XX.

But the real predicament is not just how US shipped off its manufacturing to the World, but that it doesn't even graduate enough engineers anymore.

US was gifted with possibly the best geographical position to rule as an empire for maybe a millennium but she squandered it for greed. The 1% upper class citizens and politicians have ruined the once great nation. Now US is deeply divided politically, have destroyed the currency and can't manufacture anything.

 

[CMP]

I don't believe the claim the industry can't handle 2 fighter program at the same time, unless if Boeing had won both, which would be extremely stupid if that company was awarded both programs.

This is more likely that both programs can't be funded at the same time. Too many projects going on. Something will have to be axed; the SSBN, Golden Dome, nuclear modernization, Constellation, soon DDGX, etc.

@anzha is right. This is a preamble dance by DoD and Navy to get more funding for the F/A-XX.

But the real predicament is not just how US shipped off its manufacturing to the World, but that it doesn't even graduate enough engineers anymore.

US was gifted with possibly the best geographical position to rule as an empire for maybe a millennium but she squandered it for greed. The 1% upper class citizens and politicians have ruined the once great nation. Now US is deeply divided politically, have destroyed the currency and can't manufacture anything.

Greed and hubris have always destroyed civilizations throughout history. That will never change.