Trump admin legacy: Poisoning future US China relationship

The problem with the overt targeting of TikTok is that America's teens will see through the bullshit about "gov't spying" and "national security" because they know the Trump admin is bigoted and racists. It's about targeting "foreigners" and "Chinese" apps because it's race and place of origin, and US doesn't like competition. It's plain simple reasoning.

It actually makes no sense to speak of "spying" when US Patriot Act enables US gov't to spy on it's citizens and Facebook/Google snoop, resell, and spy on your private information all the time. They provide zero evidence of "spying" while whipping up bigoted propaganda. So sad how far US has declined.

Finally, how can a VIDEO app like TikTok spy on you? It's just simply ridiculous.

One is a declining hegemonic power that is using all tools, which display hegemonic tendencies, available in a desperate attempt to halt her decline.
Another is a rising power, which going by the natural law of growth, will attain hegemonic power, despite not actively seeking it.

Phead128 said:

Biden will hire a bunch of ex-Obama foreign policy officials as part of his cabinet.

So I fully expect within 1-2 years, the Tariffs will be removed, Wang Mengzhou released, Consulates restored, ban on Huawei lifted, and discriminatory aggressive rhetorics will significant subside.

The most recent escalations is mostly driven by Jabba the Pomp and his minion Navarro (China-hawks) knowing his boss is unlikely to win re-election, so they wish to poison the relationship and provoke a China response.

Rest assured, most of these actions will be rescinded/changed upon a Biden administration. Biden will just be more smart like TPP-style containment of China, not the style of Trump's overt brashness. Biden will still treat China as a strategic competitor, but significant room for cooperation.

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hi Phead128,

Rest assured, most of these actions will be rescinded/changed upon a Biden administration. Biden will just be more smart like TPP-style containment of China, not the style of Trump's overt brashness. Biden will still treat China as a strategic competitor, but significant room for cooperation.

More finest, more substantive and I think more effective, China had seen it thru Obama pacific pivot and TTP, fortunately it was implemented half heartily, but now it has garnered Bi partisan support ,expect a full charge this time around. China answer is the BRI initiative and strategic relationship with Russia, and thanks to arrogance of Trump administration, different countries will hedge their bets and will not blindly follow the US.

Phead128 said:

The problem with the overt targeting of TikTok is that America's teens will see through the bullshit about "gov't spying" and "national security" because they know the Trump admin is bigoted and racists. It's about targeting "foreigners" and "Chinese" apps because it's race and place of origin, and US doesn't like competition. It's plain simple reasoning.

It actually makes no sense to speak of "spying" when US Patriot Act enables US gov't to spy on it's citizens and Facebook/Google snoop, resell, and spy on your private information all the time. They provide zero evidence of "spying" while whipping up bigoted propaganda. So sad how far US has declined.

Finally, how can a VIDEO app like TikTok spy on you? It's just simply ridiculous.

Click to expand...

what's the point of China spying on American teenagers and youth?
is there real significant gain to Chinese espionage service for doing so ? I think the American teenagers and youth know the answers and are bewildered too.
So I would argue banning TikTok is an own goal, by sowing the seed of discontent and planting the dawn of realisation of decline of American prestige and power among the youth population. But am I imagining and exaggerating thing here, concerning the damage done to the collective psyche and self image ??

Phead128 said:

Rest assured, most of these actions will be rescinded/changed upon a Biden administration. Biden will just be more smart like TPP-style containment of China, not the style of Trump's overt brashness. Biden will still treat China as a strategic competitor, but significant room for cooperation.

Click to expand...

I don't see TPP as insurmountable.

Suppose China were to reduce government involvement in the economy and join TPP in 5 year's time.

By the time this happens, Chinese companies will be able to win against any foreign competitors without government support anyway.

That comes from the sheer size of the Chinese domestic market, which local companies understand better, plus the already high levels of Chinese R&D spending to create innovative world-class products. Just look at the figures for yourself.

So you still end up with the same result, no matter if the US joins TPP.
Or if China decides to join or stay out of TPP.

ansy1968 said:

hi Phead128,

Rest assured, most of these actions will be rescinded/changed upon a Biden administration. Biden will just be more smart like TPP-style containment of China, not the style of Trump's overt brashness. Biden will still treat China as a strategic competitor, but significant room for cooperation.

More finest, more substantive and I think more effective, China had seen it thru Obama pacific pivot and TTP, fortunately it was implemented half heartily, but now it has garnered Bi partisan support ,expect a full charge this time around. China answer is the BRI initiative and strategic relationship with Russia, and thanks to arrogance of Trump administration, different countries will hedge their bets and will not blindly follow the US.

Click to expand...

On one hand, I actually don't believe the US POTUS (not since JFK anyway) holds any real power, be it Obama, Trump, or Biden. The foreign policy of US doesn't change much no matter who is the current president

However, on the other hand, its clear to me that Trump, and everyone he has in his administration, including Pompeo, Cotton, Bannon, Wilber Ross, etc are bona fide White Supremacists that have a hard-on against Chinese people and anything that isn't West/White... It is crystal clear to me that the likes of Trump etc hate China not only because of hegemony but also because of deeply racists compulsions that they cannot control, and I didn't sense this in Obama...

BMEWS said:

On one hand, I actually don't believe the US POTUS (not since JFK anyway) holds any real power, be it Obama, Trump, or Biden. The foreign policy of US doesn't change much no matter who is the current president

However, on the other hand, its clear to me that Trump, and everyone he has in his administration, including Pompeo, Cotton, Bannon, Wilber Ross, etc are bona fide White Supremacists that have a hard-on against Chinese people and anything that isn't West/White... It is crystal clear to me that the likes of Trump etc hate China not only because of hegemony but also because of deeply racists compulsions that they cannot control, and I didn't sense this in Obama...

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On the other hand, Mnuchin doesn't seem like a China hawk. I bet even the idea of selling TikTok to the U.S. companies came from him, instead of banning it outright from RonVarra.
It seems bankers made good Chinese friends, compared to Senator/Military Higher-Ups/Law enforcement officers.

Trump forcing TikTok to sell to m$ft is also about detering the future possibility of TikTok being used in China digital Yuan as a threat to US petrodollar hegemony and reserve currency status.

TikTok is the only foreign app to have mass adoption in the US and the West, so unlike WeChat, it can be easily transformed into an international payment system with the digital Yuan at the center.

With MSFT purchase, this is the US turning tables around, using the US version of TikTok to corner the world and then imposing a US led MS version of the failed facebook libra as dollar replacement

caudaceus said:

On the other hand, Mnuchin doesn't seem like a China hawk. I bet even the idea of selling TikTok to the U.S. companies came from him, instead of banning it outright from RonVarra.
It seems bankers made good Chinese friends, compared to Senator/Military Higher-Ups/Law enforcement officers.

Click to expand...

Hi caudaceus,

It seems bankers made good Chinese friends, compared to Senator/Military Higher-Ups/Law enforcement officers.

Its not being friendly with China, Its the reality of coming danger. After crunching the numbers, It really dawn on the TRUMP economic manager the danger of America economy collapse. Any more destabilization effort will only hasten it. The only solution is cooperation especially with China like what they did in 2009. That is why there is a disconnect within the Trump administration, A plea for dollar support at the same time creating restriction. It really show the incompetence of Trump presidency and his lack of leadership.

BMEWS said:

Trump forcing TikTok to sell to m$ft is also about detering the future possibility of TikTok being used in China digital Yuan as a threat to US petrodollar hegemony and reserve currency status.

TikTok is the only foreign app to have mass adoption in the US and the West, so unlike WeChat, it can be easily transformed into an international payment system with the digital Yuan at the center.

With MSFT purchase, this is the US turning tables around, using the US version of TikTok to corner the world and then imposing a US led MS version of the failed facebook libra as dollar replacement

Click to expand...

Not looking good for China... word on the street is that after TikTok/WeChat the USA is going after DJI next, another one of China's national campaigns and of course the DHS and other alphabet soup agencies have been pushing the National Security angle/narrative on Chinese made drones (esp DJI) for a long time...

A possible buyer might be Apple this time around. US drone/ UAS/FAA laws and regulations are drastically cahgning whereby its basically killing off the hobbiests drones and rc stuff to make room for the big players like the Amazon deliveries of the world, so the new laws will dictate every drone must be connected to the internet to fly and constantly broadcast signal /ID, able to be shutdown, remote controlled remotely by US gov/ local police etc... and there is no way the US gov will allow DJI to be a part of this future... not unless it was sold to US companies...

Lets say DJI says no to the TikTok sellout path and tells US gov to shove it... well then its not a matter of just losing the US consumer drone market (face it DJI already lost the industrial and government userbase/marketshare because of US geopolitics etc) well then the US government turns around and "Huawei"s the DJI...

The DJI flagship drones like the money making MAVIC series uses the Movidius chip for its AI, from autoland to self tracking to any dozens of the intelligent flight modes, it is what enables the Mavic to have these functionalities. Just like Microsoft is buying TikTok and Nvidia is buying out ARM, the Intel bought the Movidius (from European company)... so the US could do to DJI what it already did to Huawei... and unlike Huawei, DJI would be in much harder position to survive the onslaught...

Not to mentioned, they did it with Huawei, they threatened to do it with TikTok, and they can easily do it with DJI, if DJI don't sell to US firms, all Trump has to do is put it in US entity list (if they can use the NATSEC excuse for a video dancing app you bet the farm they can use the drone spying excuse) and tomorrow Apple and Google are forced to delist the DJI Go app.. without the app the drones are paperweight, trust me on that, you won't be able to fly them more than 100feet...