Top threats to the PLA "in my opinion"

and just think (im not challenging but musing).......after a missile attack on taiwan supossedly targeting military installations but killing a lot of innocent civilians, PRC will be an international pariah.

No more FDI, no more trade with basically most of the countries in the world that counts. It will be catastrophic for the PRC's economy. In a globalized world, no country (and I really mean none) can afford to be isolated and go on living as a developed country.

Remember, the PRC has made advances in so many areas in the past 20 years because they "plugged" into the world and the world basically responded with major coorporations investing in the PRC. That enable, first the basic tooling (tools that make other machines), and then advanced tooling, and so forth improving at lightning speed evident in the manufacturing capability of everything you see today.



Michael

Pretty certain the Chinese leadership is willing to bear that. Its not just government officials or the people in China who feel this strongly against secessionism. Chinese abroad are willing to accept whatever consequences in preventing a province to secede.

The US has killed more in Iraq, some foreign country, and there still has been no international embargo. Even assuming it happens, its a consequence almost everyone is willing to bear.

I really think it depends on a lot of things MacBeth.

One of them is who has the moral high ground. If the general population sees it as an unrpoviked attack, they will fight (iraqis will fight and taiwanese wont! think again).

If the attack was because the silly president of theirs declared independance for political reasons, then maybe, I'd say you're on to something.



Michael

Agreed, not trying to encourage the PRC into some silly adventure. It is important that the PRC keeps its side of the bargain.

Jeff Head said:

Those rockets, even with 200km range will:

3) Can be intercepted by anti-missile defenses.

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Those WS-2 are for areal bombardment, right? Has the ROC military that many PAC-3s or what other missile-defence-systems to counter every single WS-2?

Now of course such missile can't carry a big amount of HE or other ordnance, so I think they are not suited for taking out complete airfields in different places anyway.
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re: HF3: The targeting platform is indeed the week point since Taiwan has a lack of capable MPAs. However the straits give a naval group not that much place to hide, and I think it can be found even by fighters. After that I don't believe the HS3 needs targets updates all the time, since it covers the distance very fast, and a vessel can't be that fast to get out of the seekers range in that short time. (8min at 300km/187miles with 2.200km/h-1373mph; thats 6,5km for a ship going 20kts)

dioditto said:

Top threat to PLA? Image.

I have just a point to interject about Taiwan issue.
There are 9000 "chinese tourists" missing in Taiwan, last I heard. Missing not because they just ..."got lost". Added to the fact of infiltration by boat, we don't even know exactly how many chinese infiltrators are actually in Taiwan. It is a potential problem if war does break out, and internal intelligence apparatus have been trying to track down these people. But the fact there are 5 million "mainlanders" (Chinese that migrated along with Chiang Kai-shek in 1949) who right now sympathizes with China, it means, these spies have a lot of place to hide, and will probably never be found. And if war does break out, adding to the confusion, Taiwan would be fighting each other first; because from upto generals down to private, mainlanders fill every position, and there is no technology (and probably never will) to check the royalty of every men and women. So, there isn't any solution to this, a war like this will only likely see Taiwan totally destroyed, before US even get there, and even if US does get there, it will be far worst than what Iraq war for american right now, since like I mention above, mainlanders are mixed amongst the native Taiwanese, American will only likely see themselves totally confused, and not knowing who to trust.

So, back to my first point. Image. How these mainlanders perceive China would be critical to PLA's success if China-Taiwan conflict does break out. It is a war of hearts and mind, more so than technology and hardware.

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very interesting. could you give us the source of the statistics? I was thinking just about that, but never dreamed this many could get through.

TO mickchew: Well mabybe mainlanders from most part china are quite recognizable, but those from Fujian Province are not. I peronally know a few people from Taiwan and Fujian. When they speak mandarin, they sound the same to me. This is so, not to mention when they speak Fujian dialect. There maybe silght difference due to long separation, but definitely "correctable" with brief training.

mickchew said:

To Dioditto:

My wife is taiwanese but I am not. However after visiting taiwan many times, I can assure you even I can tell the difference between someone from the mainland and taiwanese (very easily!!!). It's not just the accent, it is everything. The things you talk about, your mannerisms, everything. And the accent is very different.

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I don't think you understand the complexity of politics of Taiwan, or its people. Granted your wife is taiwanese, but do you realise there are "mainlanders" who retreated along with Chiang Kai-shek in 1949 to Taiwan vs the Taiwanese who live there for generations? (plus the native Taiwanese?) Between various factions, the Chiang Kai-shek crowd are numbering 6 million, and it is difficult to differentiate them from Mainland "communist" Chinese since they have only been seperated less than 60 years. They speak the same various dialects from China, and last not the least, majority of them sympthesize with Mainland "communist" Chinese. For you to proclaim you are able to tell the difference is quite questionable, since even native a Taiwanese isn't able to do so. To sum it up, basically if there is a war breaks out, it will be the native Taiwanese, vs Mainlanders of Chiang Kai-shek crowd PLUS the communist Chinese from mainland. To fight such war, it will be against 6 million+ of Taiwan's own citizens, at various levels (including military, intelligence aparatus, government) thus it is inconcievable to be winnable.

Ok once again few thighs are apparently being forgotten in this kindergarden pissing contest...

Here's few quality quotes that I wish to comment:

It's different from the Taiwan scenario. Even PLA artillary force can cover the whole island using MLR. And the main base is in mainland China, no limitation of throwing in the forces.

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?? So you checked the maxium range of the latest chinese produced MRLs and you just figured it out that "gee, those taiwanese are really screwed"??

This fine analyze of yours is based on what your experience on BF2 or what?

MRLs are supplement for normal artillery and their main use is to provide rapid but inaccurate fire against large and non-protected targets. The operational level which they are ment to serve is the same as with normal tube artillery, they are to provide fire support to tactical level manuvres. So they are not strategic weapons at all.

The WS-2 which is the sole MRLs system that has the quoted 200 km range is not even in the PLA service!!! And even so you've propaply familiar that the distance between the the coastline of Mainland China and Taiwan is 200 km...So where do you get this "all covering" BS? And even if in your fantasyland you have such far reaching MRLs, what do you expect to achive with them? Total anhilation of ROC armed forces? Please...

I once counted in similar thread like this one to awnser similar childish ranting the capacity of PLA ballistic missiles which where back then toughted by our kids that could do the "total anhilation of ROC forces." The results was that the entire ballistic missile arsenal of PLA is as effective (if counted purely by warhead mass of TNT) as single group armys artillery conseration firing 9 rounds...Thats not even enough to scare the Taiwanese troops out of their billboxes. So what do you expect that the MRLs force of PLA could do?? (if we pretend that there would actually be any MRL that could reach Taiwan)

All their air force can be wiped out in hours, all radar signal sources will be bombed out of hell.

Click to expand...

By using what?

I've had enough of this Videogame mentality. You guys obviously haven't got slightest idea of modern warfare even as general. Yoor vision of how wars is fought is that you click the J-10 image on your computer screen, then you look the map of taiwan where the computergame has dranw nice image of ROC airfield, you click the airfield and the J-10 flies there and KABOOOMMM....war is won, those separatist bastards are screwed and you get the pretty lady that guides you trough the computer game...

Quit playing games, join the army or at least shut up if you really haven't got the slightest idea what you are talking.

Fishead, Dioditto and co...thanks for ruining Ute's thread....

Thread closed, I cannot watch this shit any longer:nono: