The Kashmir conflict 2025.
- Thread starter ohan_qwe
- Start date
If they just went with "yeah okay so we lost some fighters due to too-restrictive ROE, but so what our standoff munition after day 1 hit their targets and we achieved our objectives", the world would much more likely have bought in on their narrative. They went too far on the winnism, continues to deny PAF victory in the air and it ends up discrediting everything even their actual hits from their bombing campaign.
Ironically after the war in Iran the "hitting your target with stand off munition" PR value is a lot lower now than in 2025, seen as even Iran can penetrate US GBAD, even including a bombing run with F-5. So even if they were to change tune now it's a bit too late.
Ironically after the war in Iran the "hitting your target with stand off munition" PR value is a lot lower now than in 2025, seen as even Iran can penetrate US GBAD, even including a bombing run with F-5. So even if they were to change tune now it's a bit too late.
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- Battle doctrine planned using PL-15E's range as stated on it's Wikipedia page.
- Indian media claiming they've entered into Karachi and destroyed it's port.
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I think it was Lahore Port. 15 seconds of googling would tell you that Lahore is actually further from a coastline than friggin Oklahoma…
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This was the funniest shit in the war.
Guancha guys are going over the events of last year right now, they said some of the AVIC folks doing maintenance in Pakistan at the time were ladies and the pilots nicknamed them "Valkyries".
Yankee also said that meme that you often hear online of Chinese export missile manual saying "do not remove the ballast module or else the missile will violate MTCR 300km range limit" is real, he has personally seen this line at air shows. And he was using it to illustrate the fact that the advertised 145km range for PL-15E is a very conservative figure.
No way the export "PL-15E" Pakistan used were estimated by IAF planners to be only 145km or 150km range. Indian media and government may be moronic but there are some functioning people in their military. They would have applied some factor and still the Rafales were shot down with at least one at a range greater than 200km from the closest border point. If we are to assume PAF stayed on the Pakistani side of the border, IAF leaders applied a margin to the PL-15E which was even lower than the actual range in this scenario.
The whole "IAF trusted wikipedia stats on PL-15E range" is a joke I understand but it's also perpetuating an incorrect statement which isn't clearly a joke to most. They probably assumed something like 200km or even say 250km under typical parametric assumptions. The J-10CE is relatively difficult to detect for outdated radar tech the IAF has. Particularly when the PAF side was prepared and got the upper hand with some crafty terrain masking.
We can say that IAF either;
1. Didn't see the PAF coming at all and so decided to pursue their initial strike run.
or
2. Saw PAF assets flying towards the various IAF strike groups and still decided to pursue without defending or defending enough.
1. would suggest PAF was able to jam/spoof/confuse the IAF effectively enough which is questionable given the relative antiquity of the the hardware used by "PAF Blinders" or the J-10CE flying out front were successfully terrain masked and their relatively low RCS was still enough to keep the IAF from noticing ambush.
2. would suggest IAF does not understand BVR combat well and underestimated PAF's tactics and hardware and potentially overestimating what that joke SPECTRA can do against even third tier, export grade Chinese hardware i.e. a whole heap of fuck all.
The whole "IAF trusted wikipedia stats on PL-15E range" is a joke I understand but it's also perpetuating an incorrect statement which isn't clearly a joke to most. They probably assumed something like 200km or even say 250km under typical parametric assumptions. The J-10CE is relatively difficult to detect for outdated radar tech the IAF has. Particularly when the PAF side was prepared and got the upper hand with some crafty terrain masking.
We can say that IAF either;
1. Didn't see the PAF coming at all and so decided to pursue their initial strike run.
or
2. Saw PAF assets flying towards the various IAF strike groups and still decided to pursue without defending or defending enough.
1. would suggest PAF was able to jam/spoof/confuse the IAF effectively enough which is questionable given the relative antiquity of the the hardware used by "PAF Blinders" or the J-10CE flying out front were successfully terrain masked and their relatively low RCS was still enough to keep the IAF from noticing ambush.
2. would suggest IAF does not understand BVR combat well and underestimated PAF's tactics and hardware and potentially overestimating what that joke SPECTRA can do against even third tier, export grade Chinese hardware i.e. a whole heap of fuck all.
Thought that they changed it to the pronhub avatar for a sec there…