South China Sea Strategies for other nations (Not China)

joshuatree

Captain
From Wall Street Journal:......
The Malaysians are upset that a Chinese coast-guard ship is anchored in the waters around the Luconia Shoals within their exclusive economic zone. The state-owned company Petronas has active gas wells nearby.

Kuala Lumpur played down such provocations in the past; Chinese ships have frequented the area for at least two years, and Malaysia made pro forma protests. The Chinese disrupted oil survey work nearby in August 2012 and January 2013. Yet Malaysia took a low-key approach when Beijing’s ally Cambodia shut down discussion of the South China Sea disputes at regional summits in 2012....

Thanks but I like to distinguish that it is still quite different than saying a specific CCG vessel was anchored on site for almost 2 years. Subtle but very different in portrayal by certain media such as your Borneo Post example. The WSJ article is clearly more accurate.
 
Sounds like Malaysia was buttering up Beijing either for a negotiated deal behind the scenes or for assurances that the PRC would leave them alone and play the territorial games elsewhere.
It seems something changed and Kuala Lumpur came to the conclusion that the Chinese Dragon was not going away and was looking to muscle them out. So now they are looking to get allied to other states who are starring down the PRC 9 dash sumo.

Perhaps third parties have shown Malaysia both sticks and carrots to get with the program on being hostile to China while Chinese patrols at Luconia shoal were to hedge against that.
 

Zetageist

Junior Member
Thanks but I like to distinguish that it is still quite different than saying a specific CCG vessel was anchored on site for almost 2 years. Subtle but very different in portrayal by certain media such as your Borneo Post example. The WSJ article is clearly more accurate.

Yes, I agree with you completely. That is why I posted this WSJ article to show the distinction.
 

Brumby

Major
Perhaps third parties have shown Malaysia both sticks and carrots to get with the program on being hostile to China

or perhaps Malaysia had woken up to the reality that the stick and carrot being tangled out by China is no longer appealing.

while Chinese patrols at Luconia shoal were to hedge against that.

what exactly do you mean by hedge if not as a form of coercion, intimidation and presence by force? I would like to understand your view of "hedge".
 

Blackstone

Brigadier
or perhaps Malaysia had woken up to the reality that the stick and carrot being tangled out by China is no longer appealing.
Malaysia weights its interests vs. its ability to affect its environment and create policies and actions to suit. In other words, Malaysia behaves like every all other nations on Earth.

what exactly do you mean by hedge if not as a form of coercion, intimidation and presence by force? I would like to understand your view of "hedge".
If we were to take your words at face value, the 7th Fleet would qualify as a "form of coercion, intimidation, and presence by force," right?
 

Zetageist

Junior Member
A Plan for Peace in the South China Sea
By focusing on the joint development of resources, claimants in the region can reap the benefits together and avoid war.

AG-AF150_edp061_M_20150611122341.jpg

AGREE TO DISAGREE: The Republic of China has had personnel stationed on Taiping Island, above, since 1956. Photo: MILITARY INFORMATION AGY/AFP/Getty Images

By Ma Ying-jeou
June 11, 2015 12:31 p.m. ET

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One of the objectives set by President
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in his proposed “pivot to Asia” was improved integration of the Asia-Pacific Region. As tensions continue to mount in the South China Sea, however, that goal is becoming increasingly unlikely.

During my keynote speech at a recent conference in Taipei I proposed a South China Sea Peace Initiative—a practical, viable solution to address these tensions. The thrust of my proposal is to shift the focus from settling territorial disputes to jointly developing resources. Although sovereignty cannot be divided, resources can still be shared.

This approach has served Taiwan well before. Over the past seven years, my government has handled its relations with mainland China according to a stable and pragmatic policy aimed at maintaining the status quo. This means no unification, no independence and no use of force.

This has allowed the mainland and Taiwan to conclude 21 agreements, covering a wide range of topics from direct flights and economic cooperation to mutual judicial assistance. It has also resulted in a level of peace and prosperity that hasn’t been seen in the Taiwan Strait in 66 years.

A similar proposal was also constructive in the East China Sea, where territorial disputes regarding the Diaoyutai Islands (which the Japanese call the Senkaku Islands) have lasted for more than four decades. In September 2012, Japan decided to “nationalize” the islands, prompting large anti-Japanese demonstrations in more than 20 cities in mainland China. Anticipating a potential confrontation, in August 2012 I proposed the East China Sea Peace Initiative, calling upon Japan to join in shelving our disputes, respect international law and negotiate the sharing of resources and their joint development.

Faced with rapidly escalating tensions, Japan responded positively to the proposed peace initiative and quickly signed a fisheries agreement with Taiwan in April 2013. This occurred after 16 rounds of talks over the previous 17 years had produced nothing.

The 2013 agreement covers 70,000 square kilometers of contested waters, an area approximately twice the size of Taiwan, and leaves the sovereignty claims of both sides intact, creating a win-win situation. The East China Sea Peace Initiative was praised by the U.S., the European Union and Australia as an effective way to promote regional peace.

Now with the South China Sea Peace Initiative, I am again calling upon all parties to embrace the spirit of reconciliation and cooperation and turn what seems like a mission impossible into the eminently possible.

In the South China Sea, Taiwan has had personnel stationed on Taiping Island (also known as Itu Aba) since 1956. With a firm basis in history, geography and international law, Taiwan also claims the Nansha (Spratly), Shisha (Paracel), Chungsha (Macclesfield Bank) and Tungsha (Pratas) Islands and their surrounding waters as an inherent part of the Republic of China’s territory and waters.

In order to find a peaceful means to resolve our South China Sea disputes, however, I am now calling upon the other nations of the region to agree to:

• Exercise restraint, safeguard peace and stability and refrain from taking any unilateral action that might escalate tension.

• Respect the principles and spirit of international law, including the Charter of the United Nations and the United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea, and to peacefully settle disputes through dialogue and jointly uphold the freedom and safety of navigation and overflight.

• Ensure that all parties concerned participate in maritime cooperation and shared codes of conduct in order to enhance peace and prosperity.

• Shelve sovereignty disputes and establish a regional cooperation mechanism for the development of resources under integrated planning.

• Coordinate and cooperate on nontraditional security issues such as environmental protection, scientific research, maritime crime fighting, humanitarian assistance and disaster relief.

As an island, Taiwan’s maritime security means national security. I have therefore made three peace proposals, first in the Taiwan Strait, then in the East China Sea and now in the South China Sea, in the hope of fostering regional peace and prosperity. This strategy has worked twice before and I hope it will work as well a third time. Taiwan stands ready to engage in peaceful dialogue and to cooperate with the other claimants in the South China Sea.

Mr. Ma is the president of the Republic of China (Taiwan).
 

Blackstone

Brigadier
A Plan for Peace in the South China Sea
By focusing on the joint development of resources, claimants in the region can reap the benefits together and avoid war.

By Ma Ying-jeou
June 11, 2015 12:31 p.m. ET

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Beijing has consistently called for joint resource exploration and profit sharing, but to no avail. Also, China is doing well sewing up the SCS, and the smaller claimant believe if they give an inch, they lose a mile. That's why Taiwan's suggestion will be ignored. On top of all else, it's Taiwan we're talking about, and there's no chance Beijing would allow it to exercise any action that remotely resembling an independent nation.
 

Brumby

Major
state
Malaysia weights its interests vs. its ability to affect its environment and create policies and actions to suit. In other words, Malaysia behaves like every all other nations on Earth.
I am agreement with this narrative.

If we were to take your words at face value, the 7th Fleet would qualify as a "form of coercion, intimidation, and presence by force," right?

Except for a major distinction. The 7th Fleet is based by agreement with a sovereign state. In contrast, we have a sovereign state protesting the systematic presence. There is a world of a difference between face value and what is of substance once we get beyond the pettiness of whether the media reporting was biased; accurate; is it the same boat; the duration is 2 years or less; and the difference between anchoring and transit.
 

shen

Senior Member
A Plan for Peace in the South China Sea
By focusing on the joint development of resources, claimants in the region can reap the benefits together and avoid war.

AG-AF150_edp061_M_20150611122341.jpg

AGREE TO DISAGREE: The Republic of China has had personnel stationed on Taiping Island, above, since 1956. Photo: MILITARY INFORMATION AGY/AFP/Getty Images

By Ma Ying-jeou
June 11, 2015 12:31 p.m. ET

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President Ma plan is basically the same as what China want. Remember China concluded the joint development treaty with Philippine and Vietnam back in 2003. But American diplomacy spear headed by Hillary Clinton torpedo that by mobilizing Filipino nationalist opposition against the treaty and allow it to expire in 2008.
 

TerraN_EmpirE

Tyrant King
Perhaps third parties have shown Malaysia both sticks and carrots to get with the program on being hostile to China while Chinese patrols at Luconia shoal were to hedge against that.
It seems to me that Malaysia was hoping that by taking China's side and by keeping quiet they could negotiate with the PRC a deal that would assure the PRC respecting Malaysian authority of the shoal in question. But by keeping a continuous presence of the Chinese Coast guard in the Malaysian EEZ and having watched other actions in the region Malaysia's government came to be convicted by China it's self that negotiations or assurances were not going to be happening. That they might be placed in a similar situation that we see in the Philippines.
 
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