article on the Manchukuo puppet army.
h*ttp://www.zglj82.com/old/ShowPost.asp?ThreadID=19166
you still insist no Manchukuo troops joined the Communist army?
Right, an article posted on without any kind of reference is your "proof"? The entire article assumes that the Communists conscripted the Manchukuo puppet army. The only passage that describes the process is this:
苏军对日本关东军留下的枪炮不怎么感兴趣，加上苏军在感情上同情中共，这就给了解放军接收关东军装备的机会。苏军也借此向国民党方面讨价还价，让其让出更多的权益。
除了接收了关东军的武装外，解放军还接收了伪“满洲国”的大部分军队。李宗仁认为东北伪军接收，是蒋军在东北失败的开始，而错误的起源，仍在陈诚。他说：“更有一荒唐绝顶的事，便是陈诚在胜利后所发一连串的遣散伪军的命令。投诚的四十万满洲国伪军均由日本装备和严格训练，极有基础。他们久处日军铁蹄之下，含愤莫雪，一旦抗日胜利，无不摩拳擦掌，希为中央政府效命，一雪作伪军之耻。当时政府如善加绥抚，晓以大义，这40万伪军只需一声号令，即可保东北于无虞。无奈陈诚仰承上峰旨意，竟下令遣散。熊式辉若是一个有眼光而勇于负责的干员，未尝不可把这道命令暂时搁置。殊不知熊式辉就是一位只知做官的人物，他竟把陈诚这道糊涂命令通令全体伪军。此举直如晴空霹雳，几十万伪军顿时解体，林彪乃乘机延揽，伪军的精华遂悉为中共所吸收。迨中央发现其错误企图加以纠正时，已来不及了。”
This passage claims that it was the Nationalists who received 400k ex-Manchukuo army soldiers, but they decided to disperse them instead. There is no reference of any kind backing up this claim, of course.
Let's assume for the sake of argument that this claim is true. Perhaps you could answer this question then: just before the KMT-CCP hostilities began, Jiang sent his elite armies by land and ship to the NW. Why did he do that if he didn't think the NW was important? If he thought that the NW was important, why did he decide to disband a 400k army that was already under his control?
Maybe you don't care about these kinds of inconsistencies, so long as they fit your worldview. However, for the rest of us, we like to be a little more rigorous, and care about little details like "references".
you are exaggerating the CCP fighting capabilities during the early stage of the civil war. the Nationalist and Communist both won and lost many battles during the first 18 months.
i already briefly explained why the tide of war turned in Communist favor from 2nd quarter of 1947. the Marshall Mission halted the Nationalist military advances in Manchuria.
i was talking only about the Chinese Communist army in that paragraph and the 2 million Red army of course meant the Chinese Red army.
I'm exaggerating? Really? Read this link again:
Count how many battles the Communists won before the "2nd quarter of 1947", and count how many the Nationalists won. Unlike your forum post above, Wikipedia lists references.
the best evidence of the Communist troops fighting Japan are by citing evidence of them fighting the Japanese, not your pure factless assumption. what behind enemy lines operations? cite it. what 1 million regular troops? cite the units.
writer Lin Yutang in the book “vigil of a nation” provided detailed account of CCP troops fighting against the Nationalist but not against Japanese during the war against Japan. maybe you are right, the Chinese armed Communist are indeed an experienced fighting force based on that. General Wedemeyer chose not to give the Communist US military aid because they were not making any useful contributions toward the Chinese war efforts. don’t forget Chairman Mao Zedong famous 70-20-10 percent line.
Ah yes, the infamous line that anti-Communists like to trott out. Try reading this:
Long story short, there has never been any first hand evidence that Mao actually said this. And even if he did, or thought this way, so what? People like you get hung up on the "10% resist Japanese", and forget all about the "70% development".
Let me remind you that in the 8 years of KMT-CCP cooperation against Japan, the Nationalist government only distributed equipment to the Eighth Route Army *ONCE*, in the very beginning.
So how exactly would the Communists "develop"? Did they own any weapons factories? No? Then where did their guns come from? Or do you think Mao's "development" meant having 45k rifles for 1.2 million soldiers? Or even 350k soldiers, if that's the number you prefer.
I'm not sure what is this "pure factless assumption" that I'm making. I already told you that I don't care if the Communists had 1.2 million or 350k soldiers at the end of the war. The number doesn't make a difference. The fact is, the Eight Route Army grew by magnitudes. Whether that magnitude is 8 times or 27 times, the only way to equip those new soldiers was to get the weapons from the Japanese. Based on this fact alone, it invalidates your claim that the CCP did not make any effort to fight the Japanese.
