Shenyang FC-31 / J-31 Fighter Demonstrator

wtlh said:

Well, the SAC (or may be AVIC) representative in one of the reports quoted in this thread has mentioned the FC-31 project being capable of entering production in 5 years time, this is what my estimates are based on.

In terms of engine, I think it may not be as much a bottle-neck as we may imagine, given that the overall requirement and expectation of FC-31 will be much lower than, say J-20. Super-cruise may not have been a requirement. There is every possibility that the FC-31 will just use uprated RD-93s, or a Chinese produced equivalent.

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The JF-17 project was especially attractive to Pakistan, because it gave them a very good stepping stone in starting their own fighter aircraft industry. They have progressed a lot in areas related aircraft design and production in this respect. The FC-31 project would be tempting to them, in that a possible joint adventure and tech share would give a further acceleration to the development of their own aircraft industry and accumulation of expertise.

Of course, all depends on PAF requirements and their internal finances and priorities.

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A Bar Brother said:

I would appreciate it if other members do not attempt to bring my professional/personal life into the discussion. I have apparently become an "insider" because I commented on someone else's post.

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Jeff Head said:

This allows you to reach a much more distant area of operation faster and with more fuel remaining for actual combat/patrol. A normal aircraft's engine would require refueling missions in order to get to an AO that a super cruise aircraft can reach without it, and then loiter longer there. That fuel efficiency, and the speed it allows them to go to the AO are huge advantages.

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tphuang said:

Current RD-93 is simply no sufficient for production variant of FC-31. There is a RD-93MA project that could offer itself as an interim option for prototype stage and maybe the first batch while the Chinese option is being worked on. But we have no evidence RD-93MA is in production or how far off it is. And for this aircraft to really be exported, they will need a domestic option. And that's 10 years away..

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tphuang said:

That comment is completely devoid of reality. A aircraft that's still in demonstrator phase with no current viable engine going into production in 5 years is just not possible based on past timelines of Shenyang AC. Keep in mind that this first 2 demonstrators for J-20 project are probably further along in development process than 31001, which looks to be more like X-35.

Current RD-93 is simply no sufficient for production variant of FC-31. There is a RD-93MA project that could offer itself as an interim option for prototype stage and maybe the first batch while the Chinese option is being worked on. But we have no evidence RD-93MA is in production or how far off it is. And for this aircraft to really be exported, they will need a domestic option. And that's 10 years away.

There is no indication at the moment that SAC has invited or felt the desire to invite Pakistan on to FC-31 project. Pakistan has historically cooperated with CAC and not much with SAC. While I will not rule it out, I think it's more likely that any PAF involvement will come after SAC is further along in the development process.

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A Bar Brother said:

If my eyes are not playing tricks on me, the F-35 seems to have a bigger nose, meaning the radar on the FC-31 will be much smaller than the ~800mm APG-81.

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thunderchief said:

RD-93MA is most likely based on RD-33MK (Sea Wasp) .RD-33MK is currently installed on Mig-29K (for India and Russia) , and RD-93MA would have repositioned gearbox to allow installation on JF-17 and possibly J-31. RD-33MK is also planned for Mig-35 . There was a talk about further increasing thrust (RD-133 etc...) but I somehow doubt Russia would export those engines without first introducing them for their own armed forces . Anyway, for real success in exporting J-31 (FC-31) , China would definitely need WS-13.

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tphuang said:

RD-33MK same generation as RD-93.

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Thrust (PF), kgf 9,000
Thrust (М), kgf 5,400

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Thrust at full afterburning mode 8,300kgf
Thrust at full mode with no afterburning 5,040kgf

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tphuang said:

RD-33MK same generation as RD-93. RD-93MA same generation as RD-33MKM

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RD-33: output on the rise

According to UEC General Designer Alexander Ivakh speaking at the Engines 2012 salon in April, about 70 engines of the RD-33 family were made in Russia last year. Their production is run now by the Chernyshev Mashine-Building Enterprise in Moscow. Previously, the RD-33 Series 2 had been in production with the Baranov OMOВ enterprise in Omsk (at present, an affiliate of the Salut Gas Turbine Research and Production Centre), but the fact that customers order now RD-33 Series 3 and RD-33MK engines only has left Omsk-based plant with repairing and overhauling Baranov-made engines, while the production of new engines has moved to Moscow.



Chernyshev's near-term production programme is determined by its current orderbook for the second batch of 29 MiG-29K/KUB carrierborne fighters to India (the first batch of 16 aircraft powered by Chernyshev-built RD-33MKs was delivered during 2009–2011) and the recent Russian Defence Ministry order for 24 fighters of the type. In addition, the plant supplied RD-33MK turbofans to fit the first two MiG-29M/M2 fighter prototypes.

The first MiG-29K/KUB jets are due to the Russian Navy's air arm as soon as 2013, but the RD-33MK first has to pass its official bench tests for compliance with peculiar requirements of the Russian Armed Forces. Klimov JSC kicked off the tests on 28 January 2012.

An important position in Chernyshev's production plans is also occupied by the deliveries of RD-33 Series 3 knockdown kits to India under the January 2007 contract on licence production of 120 engines of the type there. The programme is about half-complete.

Finally, the RD-93, a RD-33 derivative with the low-mounted accessory gearbox, is exported to China to fit FC-1 (JF-17) light single-engine fighters. The deal for 100 RD-93s with an option for 400 more was clinched in April 2005. The first 15 engines were assembled by Klimov, and Chernyshev has handled the rest of the deliveries since 2006. The contract is half-complete, and the deliveries shall resume as soon as the customer submits its request.

At the same time with the full-rate production in Moscow, Klimov JSC in St. Petersburg continues to refine the RD-33MK and RD-93. According to Klimov, the company's jet engine priorities are the development of the modified RD-93MA with the thrust enhanced to 9,300 kgf for a foreign customer and the development of the upgraded RD-33MKM with a thrust of 9,500 kgf for the MiG corporation.

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