Russia's Tank Biathlon

plawolf said:

There you go with your baseless flamebaiting again.

Considering how well the old 96A did in previous years, does it make sense to you that the improved version seems to be doing worse?

And no, my default explanation isn't to just assume the Chinese engineers are moronic baffons like you seem to.

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taxiya said:

Depending on what kind of source you are talking about. Do you demand Chinese MoD as the only legitimate source? I know that you for most times call Chinese governmental words as "propagandas"? So let's leave it.

Besides, unlike some countries who enjoy pointing fingers at Russia, a fashion recently, China (the sate) regards finger-pointing as rude and unnecessary when China's main purpose in that game is not dick-measuring, but making goodwill.

If we then take in words from members of Chinese BBS, then there is a big outcry. You just have to go to Chinese BBS and read Chinese.

No offence intended, but I assume that you don't read Chinese, so when you talk about "Chinese sources", you must be talking about "Chinese" "sources" produced by Western sources, am I right?

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Blackstone said:

On something as big news as Russia banning Chinese from using PLL-05, because they are too good for the competition, then I'd at least expect the CCP official mouthpiece, the China Daily News, to make lemonade out of lemons by telling the public how Russia so feared the excellence of Chinese military systems, it banned them from goodwill competition. The propaganda is too good to go to waste.

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Blackstone said:

You might not know this, but there's a common sense rule of order that assigns the burden of proof to those that make claims.

You said in post #103 Russia banned China from using PLL-05 in this year's Tank Biathlon, because the system performed too well in last year's competition. That sounds like you made two charges in one sentence. So, you need to furnish evidence for your claims;

1. Russia banned China from using PLL-05
2. The said ban was because the PLL-05 did too well in the last biathlon

Kindly link your sources. Failure to do so means you pull it out of thin air.

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Blackstone said:

Nor is it my default opinion of Chinese engineers, quite to the contrary, my default position of Chinese engineering is high, on par with world's best in most enterprises. On the other hand, I think there are too many fanboi koolaid drinkers that go out of their way to make excuses for every ill. The truth is probably somewhere between the poles, if people take reasonable and rational views.

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Engineer said:

It seems like you do not know how burden of proof works. I already provided my premises in post #117

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.

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Blackstone said:

Nor is it my default opinion of Chinese engineers, quite to the contrary, my default position of Chinese engineering is high, on par with world's best in most enterprises. On the other hand, I think there are too many fanboi koolaid drinkers that go out of their way to make excuses for every ill. The truth is probably somewhere between the poles, if people take reasonable and rational views.

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taxiya said:

Well, I think totally opposite. And I believe CCP agrees with me on this one that there is no "propaganda" value in painting the Russians "cheating". Russia is very valuable to China that China is willing to tolerate something not very nice (assuming it is true), for now at least. On the other hand, it is more of a "propaganda" value to loud the negativity of countries to the east of China for reasons we all know very well. That being the first priority in China's watch list, "rigging" in a tank game is nothing.

Simply put, China (the state) is not so stupid to not to see the intentions of sabotaging Sino-Russo relationship, so will not allow it to happen. Same thing was done (denouncing/rebutting) by Sputnik against an article by a Russian scholar alarming China's recent anti-terror agreement with Tajikistan, Pakistan and Afghanistan. On a strategic level, Xi and Putin are on the same page.

Also, why would you trust China Daily if it does make an article about "Russian cheating"? From your many previous posts, I get that you dismiss any Chinese official media outlet as simply "propagandas" and "covering ups". Do you selectively believe the "propagandists"?

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plawolf said:

Well if you see someone making silly claims, of course set them straight, but just because someone made some ridiculously positive comment is no excuse for someone else to make equally silly negative comment.

Doing that only diminishes your own credibility and starts pointless passing contests.

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Blackstone said:

On something as big news as Russia banning Chinese from using PLL-05, because they are too good for the competition, then I'd at least expect the CCP official mouthpiece, the China Daily News, to make lemonade out of lemons by telling the public how Russia so feared the excellence of Chinese military systems, it banned them from goodwill competition. The propaganda is too good to go to waste. Least we forget, there are plenty of videos from last year's Tank Biathlon showing Chinese displeasure of Russian irregularities.

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