Russian Su-57 Aircraft Thread (PAK-FA and IAF FGFA)

[Deino]

Correct and in this case I agree with You.

Anyway, You are mixing two different missiles: The R-77M do in fact are available in a variant with foldable find, but this missile is too long for these small bays. For the small bays only the R-74 are suitable.

Deino

 

[b787]

Correct and in this case I agree with You.

Anyway, You are mixing two different missiles: The R-77M do in fact are available in a variant with foldable find, but this missile is too long for these small bays. For the small bays only the R-74 are suitable.

Deino

this is the regular 77

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It also has foldable wings


I do not think PAKFA has shallow bays for the main mission air superiority.
This is a model but is representative of a very likely load

 

[Gloire_bb]

They can pull out, they didn't invest all that much.

They can, but
1. It's super painful, starting from pressure from the outside (guess whom we'regoing to piss off) and from the inside(if we're from the original group).
2. There is no 5th gen choice for them. Realistically, planes compete on not that many markets, others are kind of predetermined.
3. F-35 is actually very cool for most of the world. Let's be fair, their air forces will never get everything they want another way.
Good,yet not too expensive "jack if all trades" type fighter-bomber is their best take.

Problem is the countries which want to get something else， they indeed have to either develop their own, or, well, keep it as it is . Because for many things F-35 is just bad.

 

[ougoah]

if you see the AA-12 is not a big missile, by the way there is something called folded wings

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the bays are not shallow,

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Because the missiles have small diameter, around 20-40 cm

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add to the small diameter the folded wings and you get enough missiles

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See without folding wings the AA-11 is 40 cm diameter with wings not folded, so basically i highly recommend you read more.

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I recommend you think a little more. From those drawings, it is 51cm for the larger wings. You have decided to select the smaller wings. Won't fit if you can't fit the largest part. You cannot make that part foldable. Show me drawings and/or photos of completed retracted control surfaces. There aren't any. So that's 50cm just for the missile at the tapering off area in that tiny area. We don't even know the actual dimensions on that tiny area but it doesn't seem anywhere near even 80% the size of this missile. Considering ALL of this, we haven't even talked about opening and launching mechanisms and how much room those things require.

 

[ougoah]

They can, but
1. It's super painful, starting from pressure from the outside (guess whom we'regoing to piss off) and from the inside(if we're from the original group).
2. There is no 5th gen choice for them. Realistically, planes compete on not that many markets, others are kind of predetermined.
3. F-35 is actually very cool for most of the world. Let's be fair, their air forces will never get everything they want another way.
Good,yet not too expensive "jack if all trades" type fighter-bomber is their best take.

Problem is the countries which want to get something else， they indeed have to either develop their own, or, well, keep it as it is . Because for many things F-35 is just bad.

Exactly. There are so few 5th gen choices. The very fact they are looking for 5th gen which entails stealth, means there's got to be value to it.

 

[ougoah]

But I have to admit that none of this really matters since they can modify those missiles to make them foldable if they really wanted to and they can also come up with smaller next gen missiles that fit. I just have strong doubts about those two being side bays and doubts that current MRAAMs in the Russian arsenal can be fitted in main bays for 6 total missiles. Even in those models, the way they fitted the 6 missiles is ridiculous. We all know Su-57 main bays are VERY shallow even though none of of have seen photos (I wonder why since Russians love showing off their stuff these days). But we do know it doesn't have the kind of bulky fuselage that the others use. Those allow for deeper bays and even then, F-22 has pretty shallow bays due to the taper of the fuselage. J-20 has slightly deeper ones because it is a long plane and does not taper much. And those fighters don't stack one missile on top of the other two. I bet that model can't close the bay doors when it's got three in like that.

 

[Jura The idiot]

Exactly. There are so few 5th gen choices. The very fact they are looking for 5th gen which entails stealth, means there's got to be value to it.

as for the Russians, I basically still stick to this speculation:
Feb 8, 2016

I normally don't post conjecture but now I will:
the negativity about "stealth aircraft", which one often finds in Russian Internet, calls for a question
Why Does Russia Bother With PAKFA?
and I think that's because they need 5th Gen aircraft to tweak their radars against 5th Gen aircraft, I mean to look what actually shows once a Swarm comes, a Squadron comes, how many aircraft passed undetected at these conditions etc. etc. Once they evaluate it, they'll see like "The Nyebo works!" or "oops, we need more PAKFAs!"

 

[ougoah]

as for the Russians, I basically still stick to this speculation:
Feb 8, 2016

Wouldn't that be a stupidly risky move to make? What if those Su-57 don't accurately simulate the RCS of F-22 and F-35?

 

[Jura The idiot]

Wouldn't that be a stupidly risky move to make? What if those Su-57 don't accurately simulate the RCS of F-22 and F-35?

well I meant for them to check if stealth is a bust

 

[ougoah]

They can't check unless they have real stealth planes Of which they have none. Su-57 is about as stealthy as a clean Rafale with maybe a slightly better frontal RCS. It's not good enough to simulate RCS of B2, F-35, or F-22. Maybe also not J-20 if surface looks are anything to go by. But of course the fanboys will cry about it not being anything. The J-20 is a shit copy of Mig-1.44 made out of cardboard. The irony is this is actually good for China. The more these people, wherever they are, bury their heads in the sand while remaining anti-China in every matter, the further they fall behind in reality and the less they realise how much others have improved and how far they've fallen. The race is not over, in fact it has barely started and these morons are patting themselves on their backs.