Russian Su-57 Aircraft Thread (PAK-FA and IAF FGFA)

[Air Force Brat]

I must have missed something. What photo are you talking about? By the "gear doors", do you mean the main landing gear? Or something else that I missed?

Yes, I clicked on Deino's link about the 055P or 055R whatever you want to call the 6-1 rebuild of 055,, anyway, there is a detailed history on PAK-FA, and its obvious with the main landing gear doors open that there is NO place for a side bay, as the fuse is covered by the engine nacelles butting up against it, and the nacelles house the engines and mains and that is it,,, NO ROOM for any more toys..

Weapons bays fore and aft are very shallow,,, don't take my word for any of this,,, "run your Kodaks over those pictures",, something my Great Uncle Henry used to say when he wanted me to look at something???

 

[Gloire_bb]

Why is Russia only buy 12 units of this plane? Are there hesitation due to Russian economy or due to immaturity of technology? How many was Russia originally going to field?

Because within given budget conditions with intermediate engine it just isn't worth it.
Better wait a bit for a full, mature product.
For now Su-35 is considered capable enough to protect Russian skies. Simple as that.

 

[FORBIN]

They are not going to buy 12 aircraft, that is economically illogical, however for the period 2018-2022 they will buy 12-24 aircraft due to the state of the Russian economy, lack of a proper 5th generation engine (they suppose to test Article 30 engine this year) and the fact Su-35 more or less fills the gap.

12 series for 2019 but the budget with oïl price down etc... would be more limited and i am quite sure with the price of the Su-57 about 100 millions $ VVS don't buy a big gty and mix orders with 4.5 generation Su-30SM/34 want about 40 millions and Su-35 60-70 millions for have the number mainly and right now don't have plans for a all stealth fleet as USAF want for 2035 - 40.

 

[Air Force Brat]

12 series for 2019 but the budget with oïl price down etc... would be more limited and i am quite sure with the price of the Su-57 about 100 millions $ VVS don't buy a big gty and mix orders with 4.5 generation Su-30SM/34 want about 40 millions and Su-35 60-70 millions for have the number mainly and right now don't have plans for a all stealth fleet as USAF want for 2035 - 40.

That's right, unlike the F-35 and F-22, the SU-57 is L/O, but not enough to justify they added expense,, so the small order is a result of cost to benefit,, the SU-35 is just a great airplane and for now a better deal.

 

[b787]

12 series for 2019 but the budget with oïl price down etc... would be more limited and i am quite sure with the price of the Su-57 about 100 millions $ VVS don't buy a big gty and mix orders with 4.5 generation Su-30SM/34 want about 40 millions and Su-35 60-70 millions for have the number mainly and right now don't have plans for a all stealth fleet as USAF want for 2035 - 40.

PAKFA is a great aircraft, but modern aircraft depend a lot upon the engine, Supercruise, super maneuverability and STOL are basically based upon the engine and the IR and Drag reduction are also linked to the engine(less drag less tailplane deflection and thus better stealth).

So basically the heart of a 5th generation is the engine, at this moment 117 is not an engine that delivers the needed thrust, so Su-57 at this stage is as the first MiG-23s with older engines or the early Su-27s with Al-21 engines.


At this stage only F-22 is a truly 5th generation fighter, China has settle to deliver J-20s with 4 generation engines, F-35 is a fat, slow machine plagued with software troubles, and if true the machine has failed to deliver its potential, according to the latest reports, S-200 struck one in Syria, Israel of course denies it and claims the bird strike test made by Lockheed are crap and says one got damaged to the degree it is out of service.
What it shows is why the F-22 is not sold and why F-35 is going to be one of the worst aircraft made by the USA.

So I am going to put it simple, without Type 30 engine Su-35 offers the same that Su-57 with just inferior radar and LO features.


The Su-57 needs speed, because stealth is not a guarantee, without stealth F-35 is a inferior machine even to Su-35 or Rafale.

All these 4th generation fighters with better radar and software make obsolete F-35, once stealth is gone there is no change they will survive it is similar to MiG-17 and F-4 without a gun

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[Deino]

@787 ... please !

On the one side You condemn each and ever not-positive post on the Su-57 as "not likely since not proven by an official source" while in return You are bashing the F-35 with pure anti-propaganda, none of them from an official source and even more contradicting official sources.

I'm surely not a fan of the F-35 but try at least to be neutral since otherwise all Your claims, You would be objective and unbiased are a lie!

Deino

 

[FORBIN]

PAKFA is a great aircraft, but modern aircraft depend a lot upon the engine, Supercruise, super maneuverability and STOL are basically based upon the engine and the IR and Drag reduction are also linked to the engine(less drag less tailplane deflection and thus better stealth).

So basically the heart of a 5th generation is the engine, at this moment 117 is not an engine that delivers the needed thrust, so Su-57 at this stage is as the first MiG-23s with older engines or the early Su-27s with Al-21 engines.


At this stage only F-22 is a truly 5th generation fighter, China has settle to deliver J-20s with 4 generation engines, F-35 is a fat, slow machine plagued with software troubles, and if true the machine has failed to deliver its potential, according to the latest reports, S-200 struck one in Syria, Israel of course denies it and claims the bird strike test made by Lockheed are crap and says one got damaged to the degree it is out of service.
What it shows is why the F-22 is not sold and why F-35 is going to be one of the worst aircraft made by the USA.

Each have his opinion but F-35 laborious very laborious programm sure ! coz mainly very difficult with the B variant special... for 3 services...but much progress and for agility he is much less bad than some think in more the block 3F could surprise more than one

Not among the best but not dropped about a F-16 a little superior possible for ITR for next block it is certain less good for STR after he have a powerful radar, electronic systems all to be a very good fighter bombers with all A2G weapons panoply later and excellent designator system.

If you look videos with the last block 3i the guy turn it is evident perfectly able on very short distances to take the angle and even in more without TVC can dance on the spot completey decent ofc not a F-22.
About 2 / 3 years ago I'd say like you about... now it 's different

Your feeling is for block 2A/B less capable pre series to schematize

And for the Rafale and I could be chauvinist but i look about materials me one say a time F-35 use, need always after burner in more and i look Rafale videos same...

 

[b787]

@787 ... please !

On the one side You condemn each and ever not-positive post on the Su-57 as "not likely since not proven by an official source" while in return You are bashing the F-35 with pure anti-propaganda, none of them from an official source and even more contradicting official sources.

I'm surely not a fan of the F-35 but try at least to be neutral since otherwise all Your claims, You would be objective and unbiased are a lie!

Deino

okay

 

[b787]

Each have his opinion but F-35 laborious very laborious programm sure ! coz mainly very difficult with the B variant special... for 3 services...but much progress and for agility he is much less bad than some think in more the block 3F could surprise more than one

Not among the best but not dropped about a F-16 a little superior possible for ITR for next block it is certain less good for STR after he have a powerful radar, electronic systems all to be a very good fighter bombers with all A2G weapons panoply later and excellent designator system.

If you look videos with the last block 3i the guy turn it is evident perfectly able on very short distances to take the angle and even in more without TVC can dance on the spot completey decent ofc not a F-22.
About 2 / 3 years ago I'd say like you about... now it 's different

Your feeling is for block 2A/B less capable pre series to schematize

And for the Rafale and I could be chauvinist but i look about materials me one say a time F-35 use, need always after burner in more and i look Rafale videos same...

Like i said to you Rafale is a beauty I hope Dassault makes a good radar and downs stealth fighters, i have a feeling it will

 

[ougoah]

PAKFA is a great aircraft, but modern aircraft depend a lot upon the engine, Supercruise, super maneuverability and STOL are basically based upon the engine and the IR and Drag reduction are also linked to the engine(less drag less tailplane deflection and thus better stealth).

So basically the heart of a 5th generation is the engine, at this moment 117 is not an engine that delivers the needed thrust, so Su-57 at this stage is as the first MiG-23s with older engines or the early Su-27s with Al-21 engines.


At this stage only F-22 is a truly 5th generation fighter, China has settle to deliver J-20s with 4 generation engines, F-35 is a fat, slow machine plagued with software troubles, and if true the machine has failed to deliver its potential, according to the latest reports, S-200 struck one in Syria, Israel of course denies it and claims the bird strike test made by Lockheed are crap and says one got damaged to the degree it is out of service.
What it shows is why the F-22 is not sold and why F-35 is going to be one of the worst aircraft made by the USA.

So I am going to put it simple, without Type 30 engine Su-35 offers the same that Su-57 with just inferior radar and LO features.


The Su-57 needs speed, because stealth is not a guarantee, without stealth F-35 is a inferior machine even to Su-35 or Rafale.

All these 4th generation fighters with better radar and software make obsolete F-35, once stealth is gone there is no change they will survive it is similar to MiG-17 and F-4 without a gun

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WOW this is the biggest load of unsubstantiated, undiluted crap ever. And you are the guy demanding evidence for anything "good" China or US gets. Everything Russian is automated amazing and pure awesomeness. S-400 can't even see F-35 let alone S-200. You think Kremlin won't be all over the news of S-200 hitting F-35?!

Su-57 is an utter failure compared the other 5th gen projects. We will have to see how good WS-15 and IS.30 are but to claim the F-35 is rubbish and Su-57 is awesome when all the available evidence points to the opposite is just denial. Please stop trollling or get a clue.