QBZ-191 service rifle family

QIUSIYU

Senior Member
Registered Member
Then that is an error of PLA/PAP small arms competency, in terms of training, discipline and equipment.

There is no need to make excuses for them -- just like how 20-30 years ago, PLAAF and PLAN capabilities and training and equipment in many domains were poor and flawed and limited as well. But there was no need to make excuses for them at the time, because recognition of those weaknesses is what enabled them to progress and advance.


Recognizing limitations in PLA/PAP small arms competency is also useful, so there's no need to try and justify their mistakes. Just agree that they sort of suck, and move on.
Fortunately for the PLA/PAP, bleeding edge small arms competency is not something which typically wins wars.
Chinese culture emphasizes a dialectical approach to issues—eschewing absolute negation of any single perspective. A shooting stance you might dismiss as flawed could hold contextual validity within our framework, as we assess its utility through practical adaptation rather than rigid dogma.
 

Blitzo

Lieutenant General
Staff member
Super Moderator
Registered Member
Chinese culture emphasizes a dialectical approach to issues—eschewing absolute negation of any single perspective. A shooting stance you might dismiss as flawed could hold contextual validity within our framework, as we assess its utility through practical adaptation rather than rigid dogma.

Yes, the framework is one called "incompetence".

This has the energy of trading dozens of J-8s for a single F-22.


I think what myself and others have said has already conveyed the point. If you refuse to be straight up and to accept that the PLA/PAP is very lacking in small arms equipment, training and discipline, then that is fine, but you shouldn't be too surprised if other people continue to call you out on it.
 

QIUSIYU

Senior Member
Registered Member
Yes, the framework is one called "incompetence".

This has the energy of trading dozens of J-8s for a single F-22.


I think what myself and others have said has already conveyed the point. If you refuse to be straight up and to accept that the PLA/PAP is very lacking in small arms equipment, training and discipline, then that is fine, but you shouldn't be too surprised if other people continue to call you out on it.
The same firing position can be seen in foreign armies as well, and there is little need to consider it an absolutely wrong firing position when it is used without causing injury to the shooter
 

ohan_qwe

Junior Member
@Blitzo may I suggest that mods should help threads stay on topic. If people want to argue training it should be in a separate thread as you can hold an AK by the barrel too and it have nothing to do do with QBZ-191 specifically.
 

Blitzo

Lieutenant General
Staff member
Super Moderator
Registered Member
@Blitzo may I suggest that mods should help threads stay on topic. If people want to argue training it should be in a separate thread as you can hold an AK by the barrel too and it have nothing to do do with QBZ-191 specifically.

Considering rifle handling/tactics are also related to the QBZ-191, and the original discussion spawned from QBZ-191 pictures, it'll be difficult to police and draw the line.

At a certain stage people just need to agree to disagree. Ultimately it's not against the rules to have strange opinions on things.
 

Leakage

Just Hatched
Registered Member
Maybe they are willing to trade pain for accuracy and a gun shouldn't be built like that for a person to resort to such stupid gimmick.
Even in the video the person admit its an imperfect solution to the problem of too short of a length of pull of some of the firearms model. He has even suggested a rail and foregrip as an alternative. He also admit anything more than 20 rounds will basically burn your fingers. Idk why despite being the one to post the video you cant agree to any of the point
Flawed ergonomics, The Buttstock is still horrible and beyond unusable it needs a cheek wielder, handguard is outdated at its best which should be replaced with a MLOK.

While the solution is bad, You can't do much when PLA has never addressed the outdated ergonomics.

Thankfully it isn't as flawed as the MCX Spear such as Poor Quality, Mag Feeding Issues, Overweight with Ammunition weighting too much, Charging handle accidentally being pulled off, Scratches and dents inside the gun after a few rounds.

No gun is perfect but Heckler Koch is the best company, SIG is overrated lots of quality issues.

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sabiothailand

New Member
Registered Member
Starts to get tired of all these arguments. Y'all have it almost everyday.

It's probably just due to the rifle's poor ergonomics, that's it.

As soldiers, they always need to work around equipments and eventually get used to it, it's common sense.
 
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totenchan

Junior Member
Registered Member
Maybe they are willing to trade pain for accuracy and a gun shouldn't be built like that for a person to resort to such stupid gimmick.

Flawed ergonomics, The Buttstock is still horrible and beyond unusable it needs a cheek wielder, handguard is outdated at its best which should be replaced with a MLOK.

While the solution is bad, You can't do much when PLA has never addressed the outdated ergonomics.

Thankfully it isn't as flawed as the MCX Spear such as Poor Quality, Mag Feeding Issues, Overweight with Ammunition weighting too much, Charging handle accidentally being pulled off, Scratches and dents inside the gun after a few rounds.

No gun is perfect but Heckler Koch is the best company, SIG is overrated lots of quality issues.

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
Unlike with the Type 21 boots, I've never heard of many complaints about the 191's ergonomics. A adjustable cheek rest and MLOK handguard would both be nice to have but not necessary for the rifle to do its job. IMO the rifle is fine, trying to blame the equipment for bad training is just cope.
 

sabiothailand

New Member
Registered Member
Unlike with the Type 21 boots, I've never heard of many complaints about the 191's ergonomics. A adjustable cheek rest and MLOK handguard would both be nice to have but not necessary for the rifle to do its job. IMO the rifle is fine, trying to blame the equipment for bad training is just cope.
I think it's also because the rifle is simply a bit too short, especially its handguard.

If the gun, or at least its handguard is longer, that could lead to better, more comfortable handling.
 

Leakage

Just Hatched
Registered Member
Unlike with the Type 21 boots, I've never heard of many complaints about the 191's ergonomics. A adjustable cheek rest and MLOK handguard would both be nice to have but not necessary for the rifle to do its job. IMO the rifle is fine, trying to blame the equipment for bad training is just cope.
I disagree. the Rifle isn't fine, stop excusing the poor design, QBZ-95 and QBZ191 has poor ergonomics the Handguard is too short same goes for the QBZ-95. A assault rifle is not supposed to force you into holding the Iron Sight of the gun with your index finger touching the Iron Sight.

It's just uncomfortable and impractical that way.

There's a really good reason you have adjustable Iron Sights it pertains to the users length and comfort to it's best. Almost every Modular Rifle allows you to remove the Iron Sight and displace it.
 
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