Psychology Of Chinese Social Issues - Scholarly Study

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I have to say this article is one of the uglier pieces I've seen, all the worse because it takes a few shreds of truth and twists them to fit its ugly agenda.

If some women fighting over a crying baby is indicative of "Mainland culture", then is the
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incident indicative of "American" culture? How about the
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? Or the
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?

It is true that you have to be more assertive in China, but that is a far, far cry from being violent or abusive. Like many other nations, the latter kinds of behavior will get you nowhere in China, except maybe a visit to the local police station.

Finally, I'd also like to add that if WeChat is anything to go by, the Chinese are some of the most vocal (and frankly, idiotic) critics of Chinese society, so read what you see on Chinese sites with a grain of salt. :)
i think some people do take it too far with the assertiveness and aggression and unable to withdraw from the adapted patterns of behavior, or might even think that's how the world runs, but again poor behaviors shouldn't be given excuses. it's also possible some have bad family raising, poor education, or various reasons, but i can understand your concerns and agree your points in the sense what you voiced has certain validity. for me i just think it applies when it fits, but i don't believe it should be used to generalize everyone, and shouldn't be.
 

solarz

Brigadier
i think some people do take it too far with the assertiveness and aggression and unable to withdraw from the adapted patterns of behavior, or might even think that's how the world runs, but again poor behaviors shouldn't be given excuses. it's also possible some have bad family raising, poor education, or various reasons, but i can understand your concerns and agree your points in the sense what you voiced has certain validity. for me i just think it applies when it fits, but i don't believe it should be used to generalize everyone, and shouldn't be.

Allow me to give an example of the kind of "assertiveness" I've experienced in China.

Once my wife and I were waiting in line to buy train tickets, and a guy tries to cut in front of us. I stopped him and told him to get in line. He took one look at me and went to the back of the line.

No escalation, no abuse, no violence, just standing up for one self. That's the kind of assertiveness needed in China.

Do things sometimes get out of hand? Yes of course, but such behavior would no more be condoned in China than it would be in, say, Canada. It certainly would *NOT* be a "strategy for success".
 
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great. another one.

Passengers on a flight to Beijing yanked opened three emergency exit doors just moments before take-off after becoming irritated at delays caused by snow.

The plane was taxiing in preparation for take-off when the angry mob took action, following a row with one of the pilots.

Police are investigating 25 people over the incident on the China Eastern Airlines flight, whose leg from Kunming in Yunnan province to Beijing was subsequently cancelled.

The incident comes less than a month after a Chinese passenger made headlines worldwide when he pulled open an emergency door just before a plane was due to take off, to "get some fresh air".

Snow and rain had caused a three-hour delay to the first leg of flight MU2036, which departed from Dhaka in Bangladesh for Kunming, on Friday night.

Some of the passengers who were continuing to Beijing became annoyed after learning the second leg would also be delayed for more than two hours, from 8.45pm to around 11pm, the China News Service reported.

Police are investigating 25 passengers after their plane's emergency exits were forced open.

Some initially refused to reboard the plane and demanded compensation, but were talked around and all had boarded by 1.40am.

However, they became unruly and used "strong language" when airport staff took more than an hour to clear snow off the aircraft. When the flight began taxiing after being cleared for take-off at 3.17am - almost seven hours behind schedule - they pulled open opened three emergency exits, forcing pilots to stop the plane and return to the boarding gate.

Some reports cited a Weibo user's post - subsequently removed - that said a fiery dialogue between the pilot and passengers had made them even angrier.

According to the post, air conditioning had been turned off at about 3am, and some passengers had found it hard to breathe. They asked to get off the plane for fresh air, but the crew members refused.

The post said the pilot then shouted: "Are you going to die soon? If not, just wait."

DON'T MISS: Chinese passenger opens emergency exit ‘to get some fresh air’ as plane prepares for take-off

This passenger made headlines in December when he opened an airline's emergency door moments before take-off to 'get some fresh air'

The plane began to move soon after, catching some passengers off guard and causing them to fall over, it said.

Xinhua said the event had drawn widespread attention on Chinese social media.

"After several hours' waiting, did the airline take some measures to pacify the passengers?" said Fan Kai, editor of an aviation magazine, on his microblog, according to Xinhua.

But more believed that the method passengers used was not appropriate, the news agency reported. "It is very dangerous to fiddle with emergency doors," said Li Chengwei, a lawyer with the Yingke law firm in Kunming. "Passengers could protect their own rights, but the right shouldn't be abused at the expense of others' safety."

Reports by state media said all crew members acted according to procedures and did not use unsuitable language.

WTF are people thinking?
 
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I think this article is pretty good because it brought a lot of various perspectives. Each one thinks differently, which allows comparisons and for us to think more deeply about things. Apparently some of you started comparing this to the West condemnation in another thread, so I'm not gonna post it there.

I think the article summed up a lot of views and they are almost all very valid. My thoughts regardless, is not an attempt to justify wrong action, but to see how they formulated. First of all I'll say we have to admit that yes there's a double-standard, which I'd think can be considered a form of discrimination. This also stems from a hard cold reality that it's true most of the First World don't like China and Russia or authoritarian states with questionable human rights record. The impression is in there, and as tragic as it is for violence to occur in these countries or countries elsewhere, those states will have more sympathy for countries more like them or endorse more common values than one with less. Again that's not to say what they're doing is right, but my theories on how/why this formulated. Second, the attacks in the West lately had been the relentless ISIS, which is probably the most evil organization to ever exist in human history. When you pit the worst evil to what the First World endorsed the most, which is freedom of speech or journalists, then the contrast is even bigger of evil slaughtering "the good". China's been seen as an oppressor of free speech media, human rights, cultures, ethnics, religions by the First World, so obviously the Western media don't like China. Combined with having a state-controlled media which produces essentially government-authorized messages, I'd also think the foreign press are very skeptical, if not nearly believe the opposite or not trust what was produced by a formal government mouthpiece. This is why I do think these kinda things, such as state-media and having a controlled outlet of information to only government-authorized messages, play a huge role to the hindrance of understanding between China and the outside world. However I do think the biggest factor being the mutual dislike and prejudice of each other, both by CCP and the foreign press, and how essentially is a war between both sides. They each contribute to one side of a story with minimal middle ground, not to mention there aren't really much independent reputable sources known for objectivity and inside stories. For example, the Western press will cover very partial content and often possessed writing style which are explicit in their bias, while from the Chinese side it's even more explicit that the views are sympathetic to government-approved canned viewpoints. It's also important to address the terrible journalism and discrimination and double standard displayed by the foreign press during the coverage of China, which contributes to growing Nationalism and need to protect the state by the Chinese public. One side's unfair treatment contributes to the even more sensationalized sympathy to their own country and nationalism. In a sense, I'm more sympathetic and understanding why the Chinese public feels that way in those times because I think what the West does is also very despicable too, but at the time same I'm very aware of the growing amount of irrational or overnationalistic, sinocentric sentiments within China, which sometimes are promoted by CCP as well. Regardless, I do think the First World carried more prejudice when judging China and continued to carry a strong belief of prioritizing oppression resulting violence as the reason rather than accepting China is just as equally vulnerable to terrorism as other First World states. This, I believe again, might be because they do believe the oppression in China towards minorities and ethnic groups and religion are ongoing and real, which in a sense is but probably not as massive and forefront as they believed.

As for the remaining of the article, I do believe that Charlie should be more careful/politically correct with their productions, as cultural respect and appropriation is very important, but using "why freedom of speech should be limited" is a very terrible way to put it. If Xinhua was intending to take a side attack of freedom of speech, then they obviously attempted to seize this opportunity to justify and express it, but to fail. This is not to mention the questionable intent that Xinhua would be genuinely concerned for the quality of freedom of speech, which is voiced by that editorial's conclusion of "limits" and even mocking "freedom" in the final statement . This, I feel, is why Hu is also right for saying Xinhua is not respected as much by counterparts. Also, Fan Zhongxin also expressed very well the distance between China and the rest of the world.

The last paragraph of the article is also quite right. The last time some major march occurred in China generally was very politically-slanted, such as anti-US or anti-Japan marches. As big as they can get, these are seen as very politically motivated to the interests of the state than a social movement of public welfare and sentiments. There is also again, by the West, that much of these movements would have been orchestrated officially, which does water down outside sympathy. This, imo, is how I think the outside sees how closely the Chinese public had been blended with the official party stances, or a lack of understanding/failure to distinguish the public from the official stances, or the plights/disadvantages when the public seemed to associate too closely to a regime known/stereotyped to be a great manipulator of public sentiments. And yes, it doesn't help when public sentiments voice opinions that sometimes rung too close to what the officials have to say. Even if what the public say is legitimate, I'd say the mere presence of a regime hated by the outside and seen as abuser of human rights and lies and what not, is enough to water down the opinions of public to be seen as independent thinking, even if they really are independent. Again this has to do with prejudice. I'd say it's quite similar to a son/daughter voicing an opinion said by the father with a history of abusive behaviors and lies and manipulation and coverup. Even if what they said are true and legitimate, because no one believed the father anymore, therefore for the sons/daughters to echo what the father said is almost ineffective. For such perception to change, the West would have to see CCP demonstrating positive actions of acting up to its past such as Tiananmen, making PR moves such as apologizing for past behaviours and oppression, and even being received by figures formerly known to be the victims of oppression. However of course since there's almost no way in hell will CCP do this sort of thing, therefore I'd say the perceptions and such are almost certain to be here to stay.

Finally, I'd say that there's an element of China and the public being too concerned with state development and interests, they either barely pay sufficient attention to the outside perception of themselves, or not care to change, or if even worse, demand an amount of entitled respect and attention from the outside world to their being simply for China's growth. While it's certainly legitimate to say that China is very important and shan't be ignored and should show greater attention to the country's development, it's even more important to understand PR matters and also that China, again, as neither is US, the center off the world. While it's easy to accept and understand that one's great devotion/emphasis, value, concern to their own country would make them put their home country at the forefront or think of it first and be reminded constantly, it's even more important to not be too ethnocentric. The spotlight doesn't always have to be shown at your place. Not everything has to be about China or China's well-being. Social bonding includes solidarity with others and genuine empathy without placing self-interests on the table. This is what I'd think that people need to be reminded of. Finally, even more important is the amount and type of publicity and PR the relevant image of an actor/state is associated with. This can influence the types of reactions, attitudes, stories, connections the actor is associated with. In other words it's stereotype. While again the world can do better than live off stereotype, it's a psychological function still prevalent in this world, therefore it can be used to one's advantage for great PR purposes. Countries such as Canada are perceived well or stereotyped for being nice and open, Japan for quality products and some other positive traits but more negative within East Asia, Russia as very hardlined, America as what it sells itself in addition to the negative bullying image for its foreign policy, and finally China for what we already know, but also as an economic powerhouse. This is why we will continue to see articles related to China to be usually negative unless it's about economic development. Sadly, that's also how the outside world perceives China; aside from the desire for the economic opportunities it provides, there's not enough likeable PR.

All of this, of course, is if we hold to constant the other variables and factors such as xenophobia, sinophobia, genuine dislike/hate that exists amongst certain groups outside of China. However it is important to be reminded it's not healthy to genuinely believe the world hates China to the guts for simply the purpose of hating, which is also unrealistic. And even if the outside world does dislike China for some reason (and not the unrealistic notion of blind hatred/jealousy that some ethnocentric, jingoists believe), question should also then be, why do they do so?
 
Allow me to give an example of the kind of "assertiveness" I've experienced in China.

Once my wife and I were waiting in line to buy train tickets, and a guy tries to cut in front of us. I stopped him and told him to get in line. He took one look at me and went to the back of the line.

No escalation, no abuse, no violence, just standing up for one self. That's the kind of assertiveness needed in China.

Do things sometimes get out of hand? Yes of course, but such behavior would no more be condoned in China than it would be in, say, Canada. It certainly would *NOT* be a "strategy for success".
I was gonna reply to you earlier, but after typing a bunch of stuff, it got lost.
 
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wtf is this shit. i don't get it, don't they think of the people around them who are innocent? is there like a lack of effective mental health services for people who needs it in china? the amount of anti-social behavioural trend is staggering.
 

Blitzo

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It's not that the subject matter isn't interesting, but I feel like most of the posts so far has been a "things about Chinese people/society which irritate us" kind of deal... If you want to talk about it, then great, but at least re title the thread to something more specific instead of "Chinese Discussion thread".

As for the Paris attack versus Kunming, we may as well ask why Nigeria isn't getting one after 2000 people were killed by Boko Haram, or why some acts by particular countries are seen as good while others seen as evil despite being both having committed it in a similar scale. It's just social psychology, socialization, culture, and your typical in group/out group interactions.


Personally I'm beyond the point of thinking there should be a moral and fair way in which different countries and individuals are treated, viewed and interacted with. Hypocrisy exists and it's never going to disappear
 

Blitzo

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wtf is this shit. i don't get it, don't they think of the people around them who are innocent? is there like a lack of effective mental health services for people who needs it in china? the amount of anti-social behavioural trend is staggering.

It's messed up, but it really isn't that messed up in the scale of messed up things that happens in the world.
I feel like SCMP does have a bit of a proclivity for posting these kind of news items (most of your links seem to be from them), and while I'm obviously not opposed to what they're reporting (after all, these are real events with minimal distortion), constantly only reading these sort of stories really presents a sample bias regarding... well, Chinese people.

You've studied psychology, I'm sure you've learned about the stats of doing experiments and studies, surveys as well. It is important to attain a sense of what the majority of the population is like despite some shocking stories from the particular population.

For instance, when I visited the US last month I wasn't thinking that every high school aged skinny white kid I passed in a mall or whatever was going to pull out an semi automatic gun and start shooting people, because that would be unfair stereotyping.
Nor do I get nervous about muslims in religious attire that I see/meet either on flights or in person, because I understand that the folks who carry AK-47s and go around with bombs strapped under their clothes are a very small minority.
 
It's messed up, but it really isn't that messed up in the scale of messed up things that happens in the world.
I feel like SCMP does have a bit of a proclivity for posting these kind of news items (most of your links seem to be from them), and while I'm obviously not opposed to what they're reporting (after all, these are real events with minimal distortion), constantly only reading these sort of stories really presents a sample bias regarding... well, Chinese people.

You've studied psychology, I'm sure you've learned about the stats of doing experiments and studies, surveys as well. It is important to attain a sense of what the majority of the population is like despite some shocking stories from the particular population.

For instance, when I visited the US last month I wasn't thinking that every high school aged skinny white kid I passed in a mall or whatever was going to pull out an semi automatic gun and start shooting people, because that would be unfair stereotyping.
Nor do I get nervous about muslims in religious attire that I see/meet either on flights or in person, because I understand that the folks who carry AK-47s and go around with bombs strapped under their clothes are a very small minority.

Recently I posted things sourcing from them because they're probably the only source I can think of which is more objective and covers stories regardless of good/bad and also in English. Ming Pao is also pretty good but they don't have English version.
For me, half a reason I bring these stories out is to raise some awareness as some of these stories could have bigger implications to neglected societal issues, such as the question of accessibility of mental health services. Some stories are isolated incidents with backgrounds that can be concluded to be more attributed to unfortunate series of random events that built the outburst(kinda like this incident of happened to have an old grenade lying around), while some carried repeated patterns which perhaps deserve a second consideration of whether they are relevant somehow. For example it will be ignorant for anyone to assume Chinese carries grenades around to throw at people whenever they are upset, but stories of tremendously deviant and anti-social behaviors regardless of environment.. would a question that should be brought forth be, whether these perpetrators who committed these deviant antisocial acts could've been stopped or given the help they would've actually need? It doesn't do the society any good to shrug them off as it was a common pattern towards shooting incidents in the US. For example the cases of random murderous rampage of stabbing schoolchildren etc, are examples I have in mind, or repeated incidents onboard flights. Could something be said of these? And even for the vet who had this grenade.. aside from sneaking out a grenade is a serious offense, could questions that should be asked be, was there previous behavioural or antisocial issues or history related to this man? etc. So yea, my hopes for this thread is to raise questions and get people to think, rather than brush everything underneath the rug.

As for the contents I posted, I do hope other members can contribute too with stuffs they want, as I did leave the thread title open for others to post what they want too. What I genuinely hope to look for is a good discussion.

But thanks Blitz. You actually voiced exactly what's on my mind.
 
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