These aircraft don't have a tail hook.
PLAN Naval Aviation Training Facility
- Thread starter Jeff Head
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Hendrik_2000
Lieutenant General
Henri K take on the induction of JL 10. Relatively fast paced of new aircraft induction. For a long time JL10 was languished in development stage or Are they waiting for the domestic sourced engine? Now that motorsich open new facility in Chongqing, they should be able to produce domestically
A little more than a year ago, we talked about the fact that . The analysis of a video published at the beginning of the year also shows that the first aircraft have joined the PLA Navy Air Academy. And now we have the first shots of this second type of advanced training aircraft chosen by the Chinese Navy.
The JL-10 of the Chinese Navy (Photos: JFMaverick)
The Chinese Navy became the third customer after the Chinese Air Force and Zambia to receive the new JL-10 aircraft. Military representatives have also invested the Hongdu Aviation Industry Group (HAIG) plant in Nanchang since early 2016 to monitor production closely.
With the arrival of the marine version, the number of JL-10 products should now exceed the 100 aircraft.
It is not yet clear what configuration Chinese naval forces have chosen for their new advanced training aircraft, but a priori it is not the variant of attack on the ground, called L-15B in version of export , because we do not see the five IFF antennas in front of the canopy.
Visually there is an additional antenna on the back of the airplane compared to the version of the air force. This could be an Air-Air data link antenna.
The engine nozzle also suggests that the JL-10 marine is not equipped with a post-combustion engine, and the lack of a landing stick suggests that it is only a training aircraft based on the ground, as well as the JL-9G , for the advanced training of student pilots of the Chinese navy air force.
Two JL-9Gs from the Chinese Navy (Photo: CANNews)
As for the aircraft version for future pilots on aircraft carriers, it is known that development is still ongoing, both at Guizhou Aircraft Industry Corporation (GAIC) with their JL-9 and at HAIG with the JL-10. One or the other would have to adapt to take-off on springboard, for both Chinese STOBAR aircraft carriers, but also to future CATOBAR aircraft carriers with catapult currently in design.
According to our estimate, the Chinese navy should train at least 100 additional pilots, from now on, if it wants to complete the air groups for its three current and future aircraft carriers by 2023-24.
It is a quai-impossible goal to achieve if the training is done only with the (very) limited number of today's J-15 fighter (~ 24), so it is logical to think that the fleet of JL- 9G and JL-10 will continue to grow rapidly in the coming years.
The estimate of the number of Chinese airborne pilots trained per year (Image: East Pendulum)
To be continued.
Henri K.
New Hongdu pulsating production facility
A little more than a year ago, we talked about the fact that . The analysis of a video published at the beginning of the year also shows that the first aircraft have joined the PLA Navy Air Academy. And now we have the first shots of this second type of advanced training aircraft chosen by the Chinese Navy.
The JL-10 of the Chinese Navy (Photos: JFMaverick)
The Chinese Navy became the third customer after the Chinese Air Force and Zambia to receive the new JL-10 aircraft. Military representatives have also invested the Hongdu Aviation Industry Group (HAIG) plant in Nanchang since early 2016 to monitor production closely.
With the arrival of the marine version, the number of JL-10 products should now exceed the 100 aircraft.
It is not yet clear what configuration Chinese naval forces have chosen for their new advanced training aircraft, but a priori it is not the variant of attack on the ground, called L-15B in version of export , because we do not see the five IFF antennas in front of the canopy.
Visually there is an additional antenna on the back of the airplane compared to the version of the air force. This could be an Air-Air data link antenna.
The engine nozzle also suggests that the JL-10 marine is not equipped with a post-combustion engine, and the lack of a landing stick suggests that it is only a training aircraft based on the ground, as well as the JL-9G , for the advanced training of student pilots of the Chinese navy air force.
Two JL-9Gs from the Chinese Navy (Photo: CANNews)
As for the aircraft version for future pilots on aircraft carriers, it is known that development is still ongoing, both at Guizhou Aircraft Industry Corporation (GAIC) with their JL-9 and at HAIG with the JL-10. One or the other would have to adapt to take-off on springboard, for both Chinese STOBAR aircraft carriers, but also to future CATOBAR aircraft carriers with catapult currently in design.
According to our estimate, the Chinese navy should train at least 100 additional pilots, from now on, if it wants to complete the air groups for its three current and future aircraft carriers by 2023-24.
It is a quai-impossible goal to achieve if the training is done only with the (very) limited number of today's J-15 fighter (~ 24), so it is logical to think that the fleet of JL- 9G and JL-10 will continue to grow rapidly in the coming years.
The estimate of the number of Chinese airborne pilots trained per year (Image: East Pendulum)
To be continued.
Henri K.
New Hongdu pulsating production facility
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Nor would anybody anybody in their right mind attempt to fly that off the ramp! LOL
The JL-10 is a "primary trainer", no after burner, no tail hook,,,, stay off those STOBAR carriers unless you wanta "swim". Now a CATOBAR could change that, but still a little short on "poop"!
You would have to provide a stronger undercarriage for landing on a flattop and for take off either over the ski ramp or with a cat or both. And beef up the structure and provide reheat.
Agreed...but that does not mean that they have not...or at least, cannot, be fitted with one.
They should use such an aircraft, IMHO, the way the US Navy uses the T-45C Goshawk trainers for their new carrier pilots;.
It would be a VERY good thing for the PLAN to have a full training squadron like this to use like this.
anyhow...just a thought.
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Hyperwarp
Captain
The current version won't have any use of tail-hooks. JL-9G had successful ramp take-offs from the land-based test sites, but the arrested-landings tests were deemed failures. There had been too much stress on the rear of the aircraft and was simply too risky. Infact The aircraft might split in half.
According to Hui Tong the new carrier Borne trainer will use the WS-13E. By the sounds of it, it is not just some upgraded JL-9G.
According to Hui Tong the new carrier Borne trainer will use the WS-13E. By the sounds of it, it is not just some upgraded JL-9G.
Why ?? The PLANAF tested the JL-9 off the ramp and concerning its engines I think it shouldn't be a problem. The USN T-45 with only one engine seems IMO an even weaker design. And the JL-10 is not a "primary trainer", it's a fully functional "advanced trainer" IMO a league above the BAe Hawk and as such also the T-45.
B ythe way ... as far as I know, the T-45 also has "no afterburner" too!
I agree that right now the JL-10 is not yet carrier-capable, but design-wise it is a more promising design than the Goshawk or JL-9 and from what I read such a version is already under development esp. if it would get the higher thrust engines maybe + reheat.
Not really sure on that, but You are correct, Guizhou is reportedly working on a new design. However from what I read both designs are competing for that contract... so nothing decided yet.
Why ?? The PLANAF tested the JL-9 off the ramp and concerning its engines I think it shouldn't be a problem. The USN T-45 with only one engine seems IMO an even weaker design. And the JL-10 is not a "primary trainer", it's a fully functional "advanced trainer" IMO a league above the BAe Hawk and as such also the T-45.
B ythe way ... as far as I know, the T-45 also has "no afterburner" too!
I agree that right now the JL-10 is not yet carrier-capable, but design-wise it is a more promising design than the Goshawk or JL-9 and from what I read such a version is already under development esp. if it would get the higher thrust engines maybe + reheat.
Not really sure on that, but You are correct, Guizhou is reportedly working on a new design. However from what I read both designs are competing for that contract... so nothing decided yet.
I was specifically talking about the ramp on the boat,,,, on land you can roll as far as you need to in order to achieve flying speed off the ramp,,, without a powerful engine with AB, I'd have to surmise that its more than very unlikely to fly away off the ramp on the boat!
and I stand by that, the T-45 probably wouldn't either, but we shoot that off the boat with a "slingshot", lol
It is true that the T-45A Goshawk does not have an afterburner...but it was never intended to.Bythe way ... as far as I know, the T-45 also has "no afterburner" too!
I agree that right now the JL-10 is not yet carrier-capable, but design-wise it is a more promising design than the Goshawk or JL-9.
It is not mean to be supersonic.
It is meant to provide a training platform for US Naval trainees to learn to land and take off from a carrier with something that they can learn very well on, without having to use an F/A-18F to do so.
And at that it works VERY well.
The US has about 220 of them and uses them all the time aboard carriers, going out with classes of 12 or more at a time and putting the pilots through many cats and traps.
So it is arrestor capable with its hook, and it is perfectly suited for catapult launches...over and over and over again.
From the US Navy's perspective the T-45A is already a VERY good carrier capable design...it does not need to be "more" capable.
For the US Navy purposes it is doing right now for the US Navy what the Chinese hope one day to have an aircraft do for them...and some day they will.
But I do not believe for the purpose that the T-45A was designed for that the Chinese aircraft will be any better or more capable...it does not need to be if the idea is to train naval pilots.
And that is something the US navy knows very well how to do and has a complete structure with all the classes, logistics, and equipment already in place to keep ten large aircraft carriers fully capable and filled with trained pilots from decade to decade.
I hope to see the PLAN get one of these aircraft designed and up to speed so they can speed up their training regiment and do so without having to dedicate any front line fighters to that effort of getting htose pilots trained to be very comfortable landing on the carrier and taking off from it before they ever touch a J-15.