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4Tran

Junior Member
Registered Member
Fear of nuclear proliferation cannot be the reason China allows India with 1.4 billion hostiles to exist. India's superpower delusions ensure they will continue to be a huge threat to China. Its too big and if it gets good at anything, it will be a huge threat.

Nuclear risks can be managed by heavy international pressure to supply all the nukes to only one state. This is how it was done with soviet union breakup. It can be done again.
Under the BJP India will never become a superpower so it can't be that much of a threat. It would have to undertake massive reforms and probably a change in government system before it ever attained that status. On the other hand, a fragmented India carries with it a lot of chaos and uncertainty, and these are the things that China truly cannot abide by. Even if imposing such a state without war or worldwide condemnation were possible, I doubt China would go for it.

And even if it were deemed a desirable goal, China would refrain because it's so against their style.

View attachment 159189

I couldn't find the best thread for this so I post it here.

I realized two things:

Military and business should not mix or at least keep stuff at arm's length


Market Capitalization is probably gonna go the way of bad metrics. The amount of overvalued companies that have little fundamental value is getting out of hand. I know we crap on HAL but yet look at it's market cap! Investors are high on its "potential" hence they keep throwing money at it. It's even high than the company that made rafales!
I think that this chart is very illustrative, but not in the way the people making it think. For a country, its military industry serves one primary purpose: to develop and make weapons that strengthen its military. For private military contractors under the Western model, the primary purpose of the military industry is to put as much public funds as possible into their own pockets. What could go wrong?

Oh, and why the hell is this chart counted up wrong? I see 2 Chinese and 2 Indian companies, but the Asia-Pacific total is 3, and there should be 8 American and 8 European companies. Is this the where the state of American education is nowadays?
 

Nevermore

Junior Member
Registered Member
Under the BJP India will never become a superpower so it can't be that much of a threat. It would have to undertake massive reforms and probably a change in government system before it ever attained that status. On the other hand, a fragmented India carries with it a lot of chaos and uncertainty, and these are the things that China truly cannot abide by. Even if imposing such a state without war or worldwide condemnation were possible, I doubt China would go for it.

And even if it were deemed a desirable goal, China would refrain because it's so against their style.


I think that this chart is very illustrative, but not in the way the people making it think. For a country, its military industry serves one primary purpose: to develop and make weapons that strengthen its military. For private military contractors under the Western model, the primary purpose of the military industry is to put as much public funds as possible into their own pockets. What could go wrong?

Oh, and why the hell is this chart counted up wrong? I see 2 Chinese and 2 Indian companies, but the Asia-Pacific total is 3, and there should be 8 American and 8 European companies. Is this the where the state of American education is nowadays?
I remain wary of India's industrialization pace. With the world's largest and youngest population, the entire Western world is now trying to build a second super manufacturing hub in India. Looking at India's manufacturing PMI over the past few years, it is clear that India's manufacturing sector in the 2020s and 2030s will be completely different from what it has been over the past 20 years.
 

FairAndUnbiased

Brigadier
Registered Member
I mean that china should seized the opertunity to inflicted irreversible damage upon India. I can ensure that china and India will never be friendship but eternal enemies. I'd rather offer trump to let china took part for punishing India for trump. Trump would be happy
I think you might underestimate what irreversible damage is. Even Japanese attack on China in WW2 wasn't irreversible. It has been reversed, after all. And China can't and shouldn't do that to India.

Minor setbacks only become irreversible to fragile countries. India is not fragile. Fragile is different than weak. India is weak, but like a pile of mud, it is resilient.

1980s Japan was rich, but brittle, like a vase. It cracked at the first pressure.

China is both strong and resilient, like a block of steel reinforced concrete.

Don't mistake India for Japan, it would be just a big of a mistake as US mistaking China for Japan.
 

Randomuser

Captain
Registered Member
I remain wary of India's industrialization pace. With the world's largest and youngest population, the entire Western world is now trying to build a second super manufacturing hub in India. Looking at India's manufacturing PMI over the past few years, it is clear that India's manufacturing sector in the 2020s and 2030s will be completely different from what it has been over the past 20 years.
You know people were mocking Trump for using the same guys from the 1980s who Plaza Accorded Japanto do the same thing to China. They said how can you use the same tactics again?

Turns out it's not just Trump but the west. Like they are using the same guys from the 1980s to hope to repeat China's success story in India despite the fact it's 2025 and we are already automating so much away.

India figures improve but so do many other countries. That's why we have a benchmark to see who is over/underperforming. I believe it's manufacturing % of GDP has actually regressed.We know Vietnam is a big player but it's smaller than India in size. However I'm thinking due to modern technology these days, can even something like Vietnam make similar level output despite being smaller? After all you can have the world's largest workforce but maybe a lot of them simply won't be employable coz frankly there's no need for them.
 

Breadbox

Junior Member
Registered Member
I remain wary of India's industrialization pace. With the world's largest and youngest population, the entire Western world is now trying to build a second super manufacturing hub in India. Looking at India's manufacturing PMI over the past few years, it is clear that India's manufacturing sector in the 2020s and 2030s will be completely different from what it has been over the past 20 years.
The west really is incapable of doing anything other than the most predictable neoliberal thing in the world.

The people and reactionaries elements of the leadership are unhappy they are only making most of the money instead of all the money, so they outsource even more of their industry to a second country to 'counter' the first despite the latter not being any more accomodating to their gaslighting than the first.

This is the mainstream western "strategy" btw, I hope their reactionaries and proles finally snap hang them on the streetlamps.
 

Sardaukar20

Major
Registered Member
View attachment 159189

I couldn't find the best thread for this so I post it here.

I realized two things:

Military and business should not mix or at least keep stuff at arm's length


Market Capitalization is probably gonna go the way of bad metrics. The amount of overvalued companies that have little fundamental value is getting out of hand. I know we crap on HAL but yet look at it's market cap! Investors are high on its "potential" hence they keep throwing money at it. It's even high than the company that made rafales!
Wow, HAL and Bharat Electronics have higher market cap valuation than Leonardo, Saab, Dassault, Kongsberg, AVIC, CSSC, and Elbit. HAL alone have more than USD10B bigger valuation over AVIC Shenyang, and they are not even producing any 5th gen jets.

Jai Hind!
 

TPenglake

Junior Member
Registered Member
I remain wary of India's industrialization pace. With the world's largest and youngest population, the entire Western world is now trying to build a second super manufacturing hub in India. Looking at India's manufacturing PMI over the past few years, it is clear that India's manufacturing sector in the 2020s and 2030s will be completely different from what it has been over the past 20 years.
What changed? Only thing I can see is that Made in India was announced in 2014, fast forward a decade later, manufactering is still only 14% of India's economy and India's own demographic dividend is starting to disappear. That's on top of the current tariffs Trump has levied on the country.
 

4Tran

Junior Member
Registered Member
I remain wary of India's industrialization pace. With the world's largest and youngest population, the entire Western world is now trying to build a second super manufacturing hub in India. Looking at India's manufacturing PMI over the past few years, it is clear that India's manufacturing sector in the 2020s and 2030s will be completely different from what it has been over the past 20 years.
This feels like it's reading too much from the BJP's narrative. First off, the whole thing about India's demographic advantage is an illusion. Most of those young people are uneducated and work on unproductive farms. Of the rest, women barely figure into the labor force, and most workers are undereducated. Next, quality control on a lot of Indian manufacturing processes is spotty and the supply chains are very weak. Much of India's improvements in this sector come from getting industrial inputs and doing final assembly in India. It's why China has a $100B trade surplus with India.

Finally, I wouldn't read too much into GDP gains in India. These numbers are being massaged by the BJP to make themselves look better. One of the tricks I've heard of is that they would take the number of kilometers of road constructed, multiply that by the number of lanes and report that number as economic output. It's all smoke and mirrors because India doesn't want to put effort into the basic infrastructure and education. Until then, India might still be a regional power, but it'll never be a threat to a superpower.
 

plawolf

Lieutenant General
I remain wary of India's industrialization pace. With the world's largest and youngest population, the entire Western world is now trying to build a second super manufacturing hub in India. Looking at India's manufacturing PMI over the past few years, it is clear that India's manufacturing sector in the 2020s and 2030s will be completely different from what it has been over the past 20 years.

Indian manufacturing is basically repackaging Chinese parts and components. To be a true manufacturing superpower requires colossal investment in infrastructure, education, power generation and government efficiency. And all of that are just the prerequisites before you even get to the manufacturing part. If you want to have any chance of breaking out of low-end, low-value added manufacturing, you also need to invest massively for world class R&D and even more education for your workers.

India is so far behind the curve they are literally falling faster and faster behind.

Soon automation will take the basic entry level manufacturing they might have been able to handle with their workforce skill level and domestic tech level. But robotics and automation are advancing light years faster than Indians are up-skilling and up-tooling. Their much vaunted demographic dividend is fast turning into a democratic time bomb with whole generations getting left behind in the dirt and filth, and as they grow old the care burden is going to be utterly unbearable for the Indian economy. Just to really hammer home how screwed they are, Mother Nature is slowly but surely roasting their homeland to desert.

As the Indian baby boomers age and climate change hammer their homeland, Indian life expectancy is going to drop off a cliff. As soon as you get too old to work enough hours to earn enough to keep you alive, you starve and die. Either the Indian nation succumbs to revolution as the people reject such a peak dystopian fate, or the Indian race genocides itself through its own incompetence and cruelty.

Indeed, the only ‘out’ I can realistically see for India to avert this fate is if WWIII kicks off and they export their excess unskilled population as cannon fodder for the highest bidder by the millions. Of course, they will probably have to supply troops to both sides or else the side their mercenaries are fighting against will probably just carpet nuke them. But so what if Indian brothers have to fight and kill Indian brothers? Mother India earns double! Jai Hind! But knowing India’s track record, it would be lottery jackpot winning odds for their leaders to be able to thread the needle to achieve such a perfect outcome. Far more likely they piss off both sides and get carpet nuked by both sides.

Who knows, maybe this is the ‘Gollum’ role some have fantasised India playing in WWIII, that in uniting against the Indians, the original belligerents of WWIII find enough common ground for peace talks to stop the war before we glass the whole planet.
 

gelgoog

Lieutenant General
Registered Member
Tell you what, even before the sanction, Russia didn't imposed such restrictions on Japanese or European firms when they also dominate as well. Why did Chinese get that? Why not regulated it without selectively on Chinese firm only
You would be wrong. ERA-GLONASS required or car scrapping fees are not new ideas.
Russia wants cars sold in Russia to be made in Russia and this is not new.
That is why Haval cars made in Russia can be used as taxis and imports cannot.
 
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