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Randomuser

Captain
Registered Member
This sounds like cope. China didn't show up to Venezuela or Syria, refused to invest in and sanctioned Iran and North Korea and let all the sanctioned economies fend for themselves, because trade with the west is more important. As a result, China friendly governments are replaced with US friendly ones. The example of Pakistan shows what China can do if it does show up. But China appears too timid to go beyond its immediate periphery
You were saying in the Iran thread long live the shah. After all the excuses you gave, turns out you don't believe a word you posted here.
So whats the point of posting all this?

Don't rain on Pakistan's parade here. They deserve credit for this instance at least.

This is might be Iran's last chance to prove itself. Its really up to them to show it and the time is now. All we can see now are the results.
 
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Temstar

Brigadier
Registered Member
This sounds like cope. China didn't show up to Venezuela or Syria, refused to invest in and sanctioned Iran and North Korea and let all the sanctioned economies fend for themselves, because trade with the west is more important. As a result, China friendly governments are replaced with US friendly ones. The example of Pakistan shows what China can do if it does show up. But China appears too timid to go beyond its immediate periphery
US friendly ones like this?

 

Africablack

Junior Member
Registered Member
This sounds like cope. China didn't show up to Venezuela or Syria, refused to invest in and sanctioned Iran and North Korea and let all the sanctioned economies fend for themselves, because trade with the west is more important. As a result, China friendly governments are replaced with US friendly ones. The example of Pakistan shows what China can do if it does show up. But China appears too timid to go beyond its immediate periphery
Yes and if China does that it will be bogged down with commitments and will have to divert time and resources to defend governments that, more often than not, are too corrupt and/or incompetent to sufficiently defend themselves. The US can interfere and put pro-US governments all it wants, the bottom line is that those countries will still need to buy goods from the largest producer nation in the world and will have no choice but to deal with China one way or another.
 

AndrewS

Brigadier
Registered Member
This sounds like cope. China didn't show up to Venezuela or Syria, refused to invest in and sanctioned Iran and North Korea and let all the sanctioned economies fend for themselves, because trade with the west is more important. As a result, China friendly governments are replaced with US friendly ones. The example of Pakistan shows what China can do if it does show up. But China appears too timid to go beyond its immediate periphery

China can actually project military power in its periphery.
That is not the case with Venezuela
 

enroger

Senior Member
Registered Member
Greenland is well-suited for deploying strategic bases, proving highly effective for intercepting and launching missiles, as well as enforcing Arctic sea lane blockades.

US can already do all that under the current NATO framework without owning the territory. They are after something else, and it may not be entirely rational I suspect.
 

enroger

Senior Member
Registered Member
This sounds like cope. China didn't show up to Venezuela or Syria, refused to invest in and sanctioned Iran and North Korea and let all the sanctioned economies fend for themselves, because trade with the west is more important. As a result, China friendly governments are replaced with US friendly ones. The example of Pakistan shows what China can do if it does show up. But China appears too timid to go beyond its immediate periphery

I don't want to open up old pointless debate. But if Iran opened up to Chinese investment back in 2016 it wouldn't find itself in current predicament. China wanted to help, Iran refused.
 

Phead128

Major
Staff member
Moderator - World Affairs
This sounds like cope. China didn't show up to Venezuela or Syria, refused to invest in and sanctioned Iran and North Korea and let all the sanctioned economies fend for themselves, because trade with the west is more important. As a result, China friendly governments are replaced with US friendly ones. The example of Pakistan shows what China can do if it does show up. But China appears too timid to go beyond its immediate periphery
Most of US decline is due to excessive overseas commitments globally, it's very costly. Most of Chinese success is focusing internal growth, reinvest money for more power. Also, China signed a 25 year strategic deal worth $400 billion with Iran in 2021, but the Iranians never moved forward to implement it, still favoring the West. Not China's fault for Iran not implementing it. Venezuela and Syria are too far for enduring force projection, and quite fragile and corrupt.
 

Nevermore

Junior Member
Registered Member
Most of US decline is due to we excessive overseas commitments. Most of Chinese success is focusing internal growth. Also, China signed a 25 year strategic deal worth $400 billion with Iran in 2021, but the Iranians never moved forward to implement it, still favoring the West. Is that China's fault because it takes two to tango. Venezuela and Syria are too far for force projection.
The primary cause of the U.S. economic downturn lies in its excessive focus on financial metrics, shifting away from the real economy toward speculative activities. Compounding this is the nation's profoundly unequal wealth distribution coupled with government corruption. In reality, the costs incurred through U.S. foreign expansion are not inherently unacceptable, let alone capable of fundamentally undermining the nation's foundations.
 

Minm

Junior Member
Registered Member
You were saying in the Iran thread long live the shah. After all the excuses you gave, turns out you don't believe a word you posted here.
So whats the point of posting all this?

Don't rain on Pakistan's parade here. They deserve credit for this instance at least.

This is might be Iran's last chance to prove itself. Its really up to them to show it and the time is now. All we can see now are the results.
I wished China would have engaged with friendly governments. But if it thinks that it's a better strategy to focus on itself and not cultivate allies, then the best strategy for others is to get friendly with the US

Iran did prove in the war last year that it could fight and wouldn't collapse immediately. China mostly rewarded that in words. Not by helping to disable western sanctions. The protests today are the result of the lack of economic perspectives for people who want to integrate in the world economy but can't
 

Randomuser

Captain
Registered Member
I wished China would have engaged with friendly governments. But if it thinks that it's a better strategy to focus on itself and not cultivate allies, then the best strategy for others is to get friendly with the US

Iran did prove in the war last year that it could fight and wouldn't collapse immediately. China mostly rewarded that in words. Not by helping to disable western sanctions. The protests today are the result of the lack of economic perspectives for people who want to integrate in the world economy but can't
At this point arguing further over China's involvement is a waste of time at the moment in this thread. What we users say isn't important now.

Iran is undergoing probably one of its biggest challenge yet. The momentum is hiking up the pressure. If it can't find its way out this time that might be it. Then there's no Iran in its current state to invest in.

So energy should just be focused on monitoring the current situation in Iran and seeing what happens there. And I guess praying for the best.
 
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