DJI drones are holding the entire Ukraine war together for both sides, the fact that they can but haven't increased prices to US defence contractor level isn't China's problem, it's America's problem.
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- Thread starter bd popeye
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Ukraine doesn’t matter to the United States. The fact that the U.S. is being judged based on its performance in Ukraine, a country thousands of miles away, goes to show, once again, how the U.S. is exceptionally different. No other country is held to such expectations that it can control conflict zones to which it notionally is not a party.
and even then - the U.S. has been able to freeze the Russia-Ukraine war with nothing more than a handful of old arm sales, a wee bit of military cooperation, and a handful of U.S. plaudits and no servicemembers despite Russia literally bordering Ukraine. Sounds good to me
Ok you want to talk value?
Total IC industry sales in all of North America is 136 billion vs 177 billion in China.
US has 10 billion net exports. So call it 146 billion total industry size.
China has 20 billion net imports taking away from sales. So 157 billion total industry size.
I'll be generous: I don't see a significant difference between China's 157 billion semiconductor industry and US's smaller 146 billion semiconductor industry.
You also added non-aircraft and subcomponent manufacturers to the list so why can't AVIC be compared to Boeing?
The inability to produce era-defining weapons very much matter to anyone who want to survive the era.
No. They really aren’t comparable. Net exports don’t include something like say, Nvidia handing a design to TSMC which then sells it in China (technically, zero U.S. exports despite US firms obviously having substantial contributory value). Not is the “electronic integrated circuits” HS8542 as a proxy for “semiconductors” a good one; semi-processing in other countries when semis are put on PCBs and whatnot will often edge what are semiconductor exports into other tariff product likes such as “electronic assemblies” like HS8538.
IC manufacturing in China is heavily focused on legacy nodes/analog/discrete and in the U.S., it’s heavily focused on leading node logic. The U.S. has the far more productive tech stack here.
Northrop, Lockheed, and General Dynamics (Gulfstream) are not subcomponent manufacturers and do, indeed, manufacture final aircraft. But even if you compare final commercial aircraft sales, that would mean just COMAC compared to Boeing Commercial Aircraft. This of course, is not a prognostication of what things will be later, but since everyone will die eventually and lives today and has to make negotiations today, knowing the productivity differences today matters. Waiting an entire working lifetime for things to be maybe different in the future is not a winning strategy.
manqiangrexue
Brigadier
Ahahahahahaaaa Do you hear what your politicians are saying about how important it is? Or you just make things up according to what you wish to be true?
It's being judged because it's the one that started the problem but can't finish it. Bet the US didn't go into this with the intent to make Russia larger, did it?
Freeze? LOL Russia has more territory than it did from the start and it's basically cleansing Ukraine of anti-Russians. All this while the EU is drained to be unable to help the US in the tech war, which till decide future global power. Sounds ideal to me.
The main thing that's not comparable is that China can do it alone and it's advancing faster than anyone else. The US has basically given up so hard, it's trying things like being a TSMC/ASML cheerleader and then forcing TSMC to invest and share with the US. America has no inner power to speak of in this great competition; parasitism is all it has left.
Sorry, what? LOLOL That's the funniest excuse I've ever heard for moving slower than your rival. We'll all die eventually and we live today, so future trends don't matter? LOLOL
Chinese people don't wait; we work hard to shape that future. Hoping you don't get run over because of "incumbent advantages" or basically old shit, is not a winning strategy.
Who is U.S. equivalent to Huawei? Or who is the U.S. equivalent to HSR? Or any ship builders? Or nuclear power suppliers? I can go on with the list, but you should have gotten the point.
No rational person would deny that the U.S. still have a lot of advantages, but the highlighted texts show that you have absolutely no capacity of rational thinking and good faith in objective discussion.
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What leading edge nodes? Intel 4 has comparable transistor density as SMIC 7+2 while Intel 10 is lower. And the final question of consumer value is the computation speed per watt, does the x86 ecosystem offer a substantial advantage over competing architectures? And node size isn't the end all be all, as the US automotive industry found out in 2021 when they couldn't get enough microcontroller and IGBTs.
Northrop, General Dynamics and Lockheed are military suppliers, in which case the correct metric would not be dollars but units. And that has to fit with the overall strategy so Northrop will also have to account for its shipbuilding business, General Dynamics its armored vehicle business, etc.
And if you account for Boeing Commercial, then you have to account for all transportation metrics like HSR as well, since they're direct competitors.
That’s fair: the point was that there was no equivalent to those specific firms (but even of your list - Cisco, Juniper, Ciena, Wabtec, and Westinghouse are equivalent ish firms). And then the point, even if China had an identical set of firms that the U.S. had, China’s per worker productivity would still be ~25% the U.S. because China has 4 times as many people making the same amount of stuff. Since at best, everyone on this forum is arguing equivalence of Chinese and U.S. firms instead of substantial Chinese overperformance, that necessitates the obvious conclusion that U.S. workers are for now (and for at least 2-3 decades into the future) going to sustain that productivity overperformance
Buddhist temples have swastikas in them so it would be pretty indescriminate unless under certain context.