Malaysia Airlines Flight 370 is Missing

Re: Malaysia Airlines Plane is Missing

PanAsian said:

I am very much against conspiracy theories but I must agree that conspiracies are plausible in this case as long as any of the following remains true:
1) the wreckage is not found
2) the bodies are not found
3) the flight data from the plane after it diverged from its original route is not found
4) any explanation for how this happened is not backed up by solid evidence verifiable by third parties

There is at a minimum inadequate procedures and/or incompetence with the Malaysian military because how can an unidentified flying airliner-sized object be allowed to fly through their territory freely? Don't forget that the largest nationality group on the flight behind the Chinese are the Malaysians.

Somewhere out there is a theory that maybe the plane was electronically hijacked. I think this is plausible.

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Just after I finished typing my last response, a thought occurred to me which can make your electronic hijack a much more plausible alternative theory by providing a reason for why someone would want to ditch the plane so far from anywhere.

It could be that someone indeed hijacked the plane remotely by hacking it, that the voice which told air traffic control everything as ok after the plane started head off course was either the voice of the hacker, or more likely, a digital recreation of the copilot's voice transmitted by the hacker.

The same hacker or hackers could have broken into commercial and military networks to shield the plane from observers.

The reason for the hijack was simply a proof of concept exercise to see if they could actually remotely take control of the 777, and/or to demonstrate that capability to someone. Trying to make sure the wreckage is never found, or at least is not found anytime soon, would be to stop anyone from realising what happened to make sure whatever vulnerability they exploited remain unpatched so they could do it again.

Sadly, if anything this is an even more sinister and frightening possibility to a state sanctioned intelligence operation as if true, it means every 777, and maybe many other models of passenger airliner in operation worldwide is a potential suicide drone that could be take over at any time and flown anywhere and/or into anything.

The thought of what something like Al-Q could do with such a capacity does bare thinking about...

Re: Malaysia Airlines Plane is Missing

Wolf if someone had,( and I am not a believer ) If someone had managed a electronic hack of the 777 then it might have been the flight crew signing off. Indeed they could have believed everything was good. As if someone had control of the flight computer. Those in control of the Flight computer might be able to manipulate the displays the pilots see. The flight crew could have been none the wiser and thought all was well, until the aircraft started maneuvering in a improper manor.

Re: Malaysia Airlines Plane is Missing

I think the pilot or crew member suicide theory is possible if it weren't a major malfunction given we haven't heard any sort of word from any groups that would want to make this public if they took over the flight. Why would the person responsible go through the lengths to hide the flight? It is the same thing I said before about expression of power. Think of it like a school or mall shooter. They all intend to commit suicide in the end but they're going to take as many people as they can with them. They want as many people to suffer as they perceive to have suffered themselves. A pilot or crew member could have been in a position to take out the other pilot and would have access to the systems said to have shut down. Also it was brought up early on that someone can't shut down ACARS from the cockpit alone. What I've seen on TV apparently it can be shutoff from there.

Also remember this about the 777 crash in San Francisco. One of the criticisms was the pilot apparently relied too much on autopilot and wasn't experienced with manual control of landings. It may not be one of the pilots but it could a crew member who may have some passing basic knowledge of how things work.

Re: Malaysia Airlines Plane is Missing

plawolf said:

No offense intended to anyone, but the pilot suicide theory simply makes no sense.

People who commit suicide tend to leave a note. If they just want to disappear off the face of the earth without anyone noticing, hijacking a plane with over 200 people seems decidedly counter productive.

Similarly, if the pilot wanted to go out with as much impact as possible, flying the plane to the middle of nowhere, where it might never be found also seems calculated to do the exact opposit of what he intended.

If it was pilot suicide, flying the plane for 7 hours seems like a pretty pointless risk as that gives the rest of the crew and passengers ample time to break into the cockpit and stop him.

If it was pilot suicide, the most, and IMHO, only plausible course of action the pilot could have taken was to either pitch the plane nose first into an uncontrollable drive into the Ocean along the plane's original flight path to minimise the chances of anyone being able to stop him. Or wait until he was over a major city and then crashing the plane into a major landmark or large building for maximum carnage and impact.

In either case, I would have expected some sort of suicide note or video, because you have to be incredible narcissistic to want over 200 people to die with you when you commit suicide, risking not getting the 'credit' for such an act just seems totally out of character.

If we were to apply Occam's Razor to the bear facts, assuming the plane really did go down where everyone is now thinking it did, then the obvious explanation for why someone would want to ditch the plane in such a remote area, so far from its original flight path and any plausible destination would be if whoever did it does not want the plane to ever be found.

Call me biased, but I think that if the plane did go down between Australia and Antarctic, it adds more credence to my earlier theory that the plane was taken to stop someone, or something from reaching Beijing, and making the plane disappear was intended to cover up the theft or abduction.

If the plane indeed went East rather than West as originally thought, that makes it far more likely that this was done by a state level organisation rather than a private criminal enterprise since whoever took the plane, assuming they wanted to live, would have needed to bail out over water rather than land. Which requires far greater skill and co-ordination to have a ship waiting close enough to pick them up afterwards.

Now, I know full well that that theory is opens me up to all sorts of tinfoil hat jibes, but that's the direction all the clues are pointing me towards, and I'm not going to ignore what my gut tells me just because the conclusion is a little out there. If anyone disagrees, please feel free to point to any holes or flaws in my chain of thought.

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Wolfie, I have been of a very similar opinion from very early on and the reason being is that it is the only answer that makes sense of the total absence of everything.
I would still be looking in rebel held areas of Myanmar and think it would be gratifying if an Entebbe style raid was able to save the day.

We are highly unlikely to ever know the full truth and the exact details, the best we can hope for is to be right in the broad thrust.

Re: Malaysia Airlines Plane is Missing

When people commit suicides, there are many who do not leave notes behind. There is no tendency. The act could be hasty or long drawn out. In this case, if the pilot left behind a note, he would reveal the reason for the rash act and possibly other people to suffer the consequences. But if it was a political motive, then there would be the tendency.

As for electronic hijacking, it is a wild conjecture and implausible. It has not been done successfully before, at least on a commercial airliner. It would have to take the control of the cockpit from the two pilots. It is hard to imagine people with such sophisticated means other than a government with the help of corporations.

Other than suicide, an accident on board still sounds more likely than electronic hijacking.

Re: Malaysia Airlines Plane is Missing

Here's How British Satellite Company Inmarsat Tracked Down The Missing Malaysia Plane

The Telegraph
SOPHIE CURTIS, The Telegraph
Mar. 24, 2014, 1:55 PM 11,393 5



Malaysian Prime Minister Najib Razak announced today that, based on satellite data analysis from UK company Inmarsat, Malayia Airlines flight MH370 ended in the southern Indian Ocean, and no one on board survived.

In a press statement this afternoon, Mr Razak said: "Inmarsat, the UK company that provided the satellite data which indicated the northern and southern corridors, has been performing further calculations on the data. Using a type of analysis never before used in an investigation of this sort, they have been able to shed more light on MH370’s flight path.

"Based on their new analysis, Inmarsat and the UK Air Accidents Investigation Branch (AAIB) have concluded that MH370 flew along the southern corridor, and that its last position was in the middle of the Indian Ocean, west of Perth. This is a remote location, far from any possible landing sites. It is therefore with deep sadness and regret that I must inform you that, according to this new data, flight MH370 ended in the southern Indian Ocean."

Inmarsat’s role in the search for Malaysia Airlines flight MH370 began immediately after the aircraft disappeared. Although the main aircraft communications addressing and reporting system (which would usually transmit the plane's position) was switched off, one of Inmarsat’s satellites continued to pick up a series of automated hourly 'pings' from a terminal on the plane, which would normally be used to synchronise timing information.

By analysing these pings, Inmarsat was able to establish that MH370 continued to fly for at least five hours after the aircraft left Malaysian airspace, and that it had flown along one of two 'corridors' – one arcing north and the other south.

"Effectually we looked at the Doppler effect, which is the change in frequency, due to the movement of a satellite in its orbit. What that then gave us was a predicted path for the northerly route and a predicted path the southerly route," explained Chris McLaughlin, senior vice president of external affairs at Inmarsat.

This information was relayed to Malaysian officials by 12 March, but Malaysia's government did not publicly acknowledge it until 15 March, according to the Wall Street Journal. Malaysia began to redirect the search effort that day, to focus on the areas the information described. However, some officials involved with the probe warned that the lost days and wasted resources could impede the investigation.

Meanwhile, Inmarsat's engineers carried out further analysis of the pings and came up with a much more detailed Doppler effect model for the northern and southern paths. By comparing these models with the movement of other aircraft on similar routes, they were able to establish an "extraordinary matching" between Inmarsat's predicted path to the south and the readings that it got from other planes.

"By yesterday they were able to definitively say that the plane had undoubtedly taken the southern route," said McLaughlin.

These pings from the satellite – along with assumptions about the plane’s speed – helped Australia and the US National Transportation Safety Board to narrow down the search area to just 3 per cent of the southern corridor on 18 March.

"We worked out where the last ping was, and we knew that the plane must have run out before the next automated ping, but we don't know what speed the aircraft was flying at – we assumed about 450 knots," said McLaughlin. "We can’t know when the fuel actually ran out, we can’t know whether the plane plunged or glided, and we can’t know whether the plane at the end of the time in the air was flying more slowly because it was on fumes."

Inmarsat passed the relevant analysis to the UK Air Accidents Investigation Branch (AAIB) yesterday. The cause of the crash remains a mystery.

Re: Malaysia Airlines Plane is Missing

Meanwhile, Inmarsat's engineers carried out further analysis of the pings and came up with a much more detailed Doppler effect model for the northern and southern paths. By comparing these models with the movement of other aircraft on similar routes, they were able to establish an "extraordinary matching" between Inmarsat's predicted path to the south and the readings that it got from other planes.

"By yesterday they were able to definitively say that the plane had undoubtedly taken the southern route," said McLaughlin.

These pings from the satellite – along with assumptions about the plane’s speed – helped Australia and the US National Transportation Safety Board to narrow down the search area to just 3 per cent of the southern corridor on 18 March.

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How did they narrow down the search area to just 3 percent of the southern corridor on march 18th, but can only say the plane took the southern route yesterday?

Re: Malaysia Airlines Plane is Missing

plawolf said:

No offense intended to anyone, but the pilot suicide theory simply makes no sense.

People who commit suicide tend to leave a note. If they just want to disappear off the face of the earth without anyone noticing, hijacking a plane with over 200 people seems decidedly counter productive.

Similarly, if the pilot wanted to go out with as much impact as possible, flying the plane to the middle of nowhere, where it might never be found also seems calculated to do the exact opposit of what he intended.

If it was pilot suicide, flying the plane for 7 hours seems like a pretty pointless risk as that gives the rest of the crew and passengers ample time to break into the cockpit and stop him.

If it was pilot suicide, the most, and IMHO, only plausible course of action the pilot could have taken was to either pitch the plane nose first into an uncontrollable drive into the Ocean along the plane's original flight path to minimise the chances of anyone being able to stop him. Or wait until he was over a major city and then crashing the plane into a major landmark or large building for maximum carnage and impact.

In either case, I would have expected some sort of suicide note or video, because you have to be incredible narcissistic to want over 200 people to die with you when you commit suicide, risking not getting the 'credit' for such an act just seems totally out of character.

If we were to apply Occam's Razor to the bear facts, assuming the plane really did go down where everyone is now thinking it did, then the obvious explanation for why someone would want to ditch the plane in such a remote area, so far from its original flight path and any plausible destination would be if whoever did it does not want the plane to ever be found.

Call me biased, but I think that if the plane did go down between Australia and Antarctic, it adds more credence to my earlier theory that the plane was taken to stop someone, or something from reaching Beijing, and making the plane disappear was intended to cover up the theft or abduction.

If the plane indeed went East rather than West as originally thought, that makes it far more likely that this was done by a state level organisation rather than a private criminal enterprise since whoever took the plane, assuming they wanted to live, would have needed to bail out over water rather than land. Which requires far greater skill and co-ordination to have a ship waiting close enough to pick them up afterwards.

Now, I know full well that that theory is opens me up to all sorts of tinfoil hat jibes, but that's the direction all the clues are pointing me towards, and I'm not going to ignore what my gut tells me just because the conclusion is a little out there. If anyone disagrees, please feel free to point to any holes or flaws in my chain of thought.

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The flaw in your theory is exactly the same as to why you thought it wasn't suicide. As to the lack of suicide notes that is hardly evident of anything. A lot of folks do note leave notes etc. Again all the logical explanations you gave can be equally applied to your scenario as well. If someone really wanted to hide a theft or abduction or some kind why fly so far? You can easily crash the plane at full speed into the side of a mountain and achieve the same result.

The truth is this event has never ever happened in commercial aviation so there is no historical baseline to form any sort of conclusive statement. The only thing we are fairly sure about is this plane was deliberately flown of course.

Re: Malaysia Airlines Plane is Missing

shen said:

How did they narrow down the search area to just 3 percent of the southern corridor on march 18th, but can only say the plane took the southern route yesterday?

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The extreme incompetency displayed by the Indonesian Malaysian air force and government air defense is jaw-dropping. It's as the 777 is more stealthy than a B2.

Re: Malaysia Airlines Plane is Missing

cn_habs said:

The extreme incompetency displayed by the Indonesian Malaysian air force and government air defense is jaw-dropping. It's as the 777 is more stealthy than a B2.

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Boeing Special Malaysian Air ways special mission 777.
Most of the Air traffic control system rely on transponders. military radars have to operate but can only operate at maximum effective capacity in set conditions.