Ladakh Flash Point

ougoah said:

You mean finger 8. That's what they claimed up to and where they patrolled up to even by the admittance of their IT Cell employees here. Rarely patrolled up to finger 8 is patrolling up to finger 8. Their own opposition and high profile individuals are angry they lost the privilege of patrolling up to their claimed border lines.



India was a civilisation of distinction in the past. All can be lost and gained in time. India being colonised is not only unfortunate for India but also China. It is one source of the disagreements that have persisted between the two for the last century. Not to mention those between current day India and a dozen or annexed states and existing neighbours like Pakistan, Bangladesh, and Nepal.

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I actually meant finger 3-4, because of course that implies that they can’t patrol up to finger 8 anymore! Both sides cannot patrol between finger 4-8, but Indians cannot patrol fingers 3-4 in addition to that common no patrol zone.

So Indians can now only patrol up to the finger 2-3, and China’s claim line is finger 4. It means that Indians can’t even patrol within their own territory.

If only more Chinese people and people in general could see what indians are actually like. I wonder when the peaceful yoga guru image that the west have helped perpetuate for India will become thoroughly diminished.

The Muslims already know India well. Chinese are beginning to wake up to what Indians are actually like. Through no loss. The Indians have always been this way towards the Chinese but stupid Chinese with good faith and actual peaceful tendencies have been asleep worshipping the false image of liberal democracy and yoga India rather than the real Rapistan shitstain India really is. About time we returned Indians hatred and racism. Thankfully since Doklam more common Chinese have realised and are beginning to take this stance on India. Watch their economy falter even more than in 2018-2019 with a general global moving away from this false image.

siegecrossbow said:

That would push India firmly into the U.S. camp. In retrospect I think that it is wise for China to drag it out post presidential election. Biden, while still a friend of India, does not support the batshit measures advocated by Trump/Pompeo.

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Ahh I'm convinced India's more than already there. If anything India's the OG anti-China crew or a part of ever since Nehru.

This armed stalemate is like an arm race that causing more distress to india since it has way more troops up front and had difficulty in supply. Each day it has to spend like $50million.
Chinese media also mentioned the appearance of 99A intimidated Indian forces.

I don't know why China agreeing on withdraw. It should let India keep on bleeding..

TheFoozyOne said:

I actually meant finger 3-4, because of course that implies that they can’t patrol up to finger 8 anymore! Both sides cannot patrol between finger 4-8, but Indians cannot patrol fingers 3-4 in addition to that common no patrol zone.

So Indians can now only patrol up to the finger 2-3, and China’s claim line is finger 4. It means that Indians can’t even patrol within their own territory.

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Well they'd argue that China also cannot patrol its claims. Anyway the nuance has been explained with LAC perception shifts and bilateral behaviour since the early 2010s.

siegecrossbow said:

That would push India firmly into the U.S. camp. In retrospect I think that it is wise for China to drag it out post presidential election. Biden, while still a friend of India, does not support the batshit measures advocated by Trump/Pompeo.

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They are very much in USA's camp already. Their actions seem consistent with it, USA's rhetoric has always seemed in line with it, and for the most part, their population seem to have no problems with it either. Almost as if they suddenly forgot the fact Nixon was ready to go to war with India in 1971, and it could just as easily happen in the future once they are done being used. There is no need to pretend it could go any other way, and so like I said, once they inevitably try to creep back up to Finger 3, 4, 5,... there would be no net loss by 'persuading' them to go home with a salvo of 370mm

Oldschool said:

This armed stalemate is like an arm race that causing more distress to india since it has way more troops up front and had difficulty in supply. Each day it has to spend like $50million.
Chinese media also mentioned the appearance of 99A intimidated Indian forces.

I don't know why China agreeing on withdraw. It should let India keep on bleeding..

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Because China captured fingers 4 to 8 to force this.

It can be argued the whole point of PLA "responding" to what China called Indian provocations from Art. 370 to road building leading up to LAC buffer, was to force India into finally observing 1959 deal and the LAC from the 1990s which stipulate the claims being up to fingers 3 and 8 but the perception of LAC being somewhere in between. China's 1959 deal and offer to India was to end this dispute with a divide down the middle. India never conceded to that deal with insistence on claiming everything up to finger 8.

Since PLA captured fingers 4 to 8, India and China talks resulted in enforced buffer zone from fingers 3 to 8. Essentially the effective equivalent of the 1959 deal only with PLA showing no presence as well in an effort to make all this a little more palatable.

How else will PLA dominate for a year with India challenging through violence and attempted capture of Chinese land only to fail each time with PLA sitting pretty.

If it were IA who pushed out PLA during that year long period and if it were IA that captured it, then India went in negotiations with upper hand and would probably be demanding for recognition of their claims (up to finger 8) but the result was buffer and India behind finger 3. This is basically 1959 deal with India even further behind finger 4 but with the condition that PLA makes a show of leaving what they occupied for a year. Something that China would need to agree to lest those Jai Hinds actually understand their opposition and realising they got shafted.

TheFoozyOne said:

I actually meant finger 3-4, because of course that implies that they can’t patrol up to finger 8 anymore! Both sides cannot patrol between finger 4-8, but Indians cannot patrol fingers 3-4 in addition to that common no patrol zone.

So Indians can now only patrol up to the finger 2-3, and China’s claim line is finger 4. It means that Indians can’t even patrol within their own territory.

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You forgot to include the fact China also can not patrol bw F4-F8 where they built roads and what not.

According to disengagement plan both party should restore the same status before the clashes that means India return to their post near F3 and China back to F8.

That means both China and India don't go beyond their last post on the lake.

It pays to remind ourselves this is a group of morons who insist on believing their Mig-21 miraculously shot down an F-16 with a non-existent missile on a non-existent pylon, all while it was being shot at. Not even semi-active missiles and the downed Mi-21 could still guide that non-existent Jai Hind magic missile onto an F-16 through the pure cow piss magic focus of Abhi's laser like sight. Human mounted sight missile guidance invented in India first heard.

lp1g said:

You forgot to include the fact China also can not patrol bw F4-F8 where they built roads and what not.

According to disengagement plan both party should restore the same status before the clashes that means India return to their post near F3 and China back to F8.

That means both China and India don't go beyond their last post on the river.

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You forgot that you went to claim galwan, only to "disengage" half kilometer.
Also you forgot to mention, you went beyond Finer 3, not 4, You were pushed within your own land
You also forgot, as part of "disengagement" , now you have to vacate all the so called height advantage within your own territory.

Most importantly, there is no "perceived territory". Either you have it or you don't. What china says is another matter. Now you can't patrol your own territory. China can "perceive" more territory & push you even further. Already they did vacate their claimed land