Re: New Generation Fighter
It's amazing how much handholding you actually require to get through an argument which you barely even comprehend. SEAD encompasses DEAD and is not some separate mission. You need to educate yourself more before you come back to this discussion. Here, let me help you with your education:
fas. org/ man/ crs/ RS21141. pdf [delete the spaces after the periods]
Yet more petulant crap. Guess that's just the level of maturity you are capable of.
Its not handholding, as I have said before, I have not seen any evidence that you know the first thing about what you are talking about. And the more petulant and evasive the response when I ask you to demonstrate even the most basic concepts, the stronger the support for my belief.
A stealth platform inherently defeats the very purpose of the wild weasel as a bait aircraft. The enemy has to know you're there. It has to light you up with an illumination radar for you to know it's there and attack it with a HARM or other PGM. And actually, since neither the F-22 nor the J-20 are likely to have the jamming capabilities of a Prowler or Growler, they will not even be able to non-destructively suppress any air defenses by means of electromagnetic interference either.
Again, this completely nonsensical insistence that stealth aircraft cannot perform SEAD/DEAD and not a work to explain why.
As Scratch has already explained perfectly well, if you want to provoke SAM radars to go active with a stealth aircraft, all you need to do is turn on the jammer. Any SAMs doing passive scans will see that and go active. But unlike conventional fighters, a stealth plane will not show up on enemy radars unless its very close. That means there is less risk to the aircraft, and also a higher chance of achieving DEAD since a radar that turned on and is immediately blinded by jamming is more likely to turn off and scoot as the crew knows they can't do anything and is also likely to know that they just been tricked into lighting up by wild weasels.
This must surely be a joke coming from someone with your level of insolence. You don't even nearly have the intellectual authority to talk down to anyone the way you tried to talk down to me, so don't start acting like somehow you are the aggrieved party here.
Insolence? Guess that's just your own angry attitude bleeding into your interpretation of what others are writing.
All I am asking are very simple, basic questions, and so far, you have failed quite spectacularly are adequately answering ANY of them. The facts speak for themselves.
OMFG get a clue. For some reason you queerly took issue with my use of the term "flying under stealth" and tried to blow it up into a mass of unintelligible gibberish by invoking Star Trek and other associated nonsense. I explained to you what flying under stealth for stealth aircraft means since you seemed not to understand WTF you were talking about when you said that "your fighter is stealthy no matter where you fly it". It's just not, and that's a plain fact. And now you understand why.
Queerly? Truly pathetic.
And I stand by my raising of that point with you, since by your very definition, we can see you do not know even the basics since aircraft, even stealth ones, do not 'fly under stealth' - ie evade enemy radar sites, when on SEAD/DEAD missions.
Again your ignorance is showing. With a standard 4th generation SEAD mission, you have two aircraft (or possibly even one with the Growler), a wild weasel and a jammer flying into enemy airspace. They know you are there because their long range surveillance radars have been tracking you. OTH and any multitude of early warning radars and AEW/C aircraft with overlapping coverage will be keeping tabs on you even if some of those radar nodes are disabled or destroyed. This is the modern SEAD environment. The problem is that these are not the FCR's that will be lighting you up and guiding missiles into your aircraft. The ones that do are the ones that are dangerous because you don't know where they are until they turn on. That's where the combo of wild weasel and jammer come into play. When you're flying a stealth aircraft nobody has any clue where exactly you are. You pass through the area and have not swept it clean of SAM batteries because YOU don't know where they are either.
No, its because you clearly cannot grasp how much of an advantage a 5th gen stealth platform would have over conventional aircraft in the SEAD, and especially, DEAD roles.
Long range radars may be able to easily track 4th gen SEAD/DEAD aircraft and feed that information to forward SAM sites, but by its very nature, you cannot track 5th gen fighters from long range.
If the enemy used long wave 'anti stealth' radars to detect that there are 5th gens coming in, that will only make DEAD easier as the forward SAM sites are ordered to light up to search for targets and so expose themselves.
If the enemy does not light up any SAM sites, but are emitting with long range ground based or land based radars, thats even better, as you just push through the forward SAM belts and take those out first.
Was that such a difficult concept to grasp?
No, it's your own fault that you don't have the first damn clue that DEAD is included in SEAD rather than a separate mission. None other than the Department of Defense disagrees with your loonie compartmentalization. See above. Actually, let me quote it for you just so that you can see it again for the second time, in case you aren't quick enough to pick it up the first time:
Loonie?
I know Sampan already warned you, but I wonder if he actually ready all of your post and picked up on all the pathetically childish insults you squeezed in there.
And you letting your petulance and angry blind you. I was trying to give you the benefit of the doubt, but this just proves you are willfully ignorant about the subject matter. DEAD might be achieved during SEAD, but there are completely different tactics and requirements depending on whether you set out to perform SEAD or DEAD.
If you achieved DEAD while on a SEAD mission, good for you. Bonus points, but if you only managed to achieve SEAD while on a DEAD mission, well, no cigar for you.
By the very fact that stealth platforms cannot target and destroy SAM FCR's that they don't know are there means that stealth platforms cannot perform SEAD in its "entirety". Oh, and AFAIK they can't standoff jam either. Even less "entirety" for you there.
It is by no stretch of the imagination a 'fact', and so far you have been able to offer up ZERO evidence, or a plausible argument on why stealth aircraft cannot target and destroy SAM FCR.
You also cannot seem to even fully understand that extract you quoted yourself.
Standoff jamming is a method or achieving SEAD, however, it is not a requirement of a SEAD mission to always carry out standoff jamming.
I can only giggle slightly as I read this.
You know what they say about people who are too easily amused don't you?
