J-20... The New Generation Fighter II

challenge said:

one factor why J-20 was slightly bigger may be the engine, the russian and China inability produce compact high T:W ratio ,high thrust jet engine.
J-10 has to undergoes redesign ,since AL-31F for example was 23% heavier than PW F-101 engine .result fuselage is longer than lavi

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That is true to a certain extent. However we have to keep in mind that the J-10, unlike the Lavi, was designed primarily for air to air combat (the Lavi focused on air to ground capabilities) and was a good intercepting platform capable of Mach 2+ speeds. The length of J-10 and J-20 could also reflect upon the high-speed philosophy.

J-20 is larger than F-22 because of its mission requirements

As I understand it, there are at least three reasons that the J-20 is larger than the F-22. Firstly, China does not have a large fleet of air-refueling tankers. This means that the J-20 must carry more fuel to compensate for the deficiency in air-refueling.

Secondly, the F-22 is designed to control airspace near American bases in Japan or South Korea. In contrast, the J-20 is designed to control the airspace in faraway places like the South China Sea or beyond the world's tallest mountain range.

Thirdly, the only country likely to challenge China plans to build 2,000 F-35s. China's J-20s must carry sufficient fuel to chase down F-35s trying to escape with their afterburners.

In conclusion, the J-20 is larger than a F-22 because of China's mission requirements:

1. Avoid necessity of air-refueling

2. Control distant airspace, such as the South China Sea

3. Hunt down enemy aircraft trying to escape with afterburners

Re: J-20 is larger than F-22 because of its mission requirements

Martian said:

As I understand it, there are at least three reasons that the J-20 is larger than the F-22. Firstly, China does not have a large fleet of air-refueling tankers. This means that the J-20 must carry more fuel to compensate for the deficiency in air-refueling.

Secondly, the F-22 is designed to control airspace near American bases in Japan or South Korea. In contrast, the J-20 is designed to control the airspace in faraway places like the South China Sea or beyond the world's tallest mountain range.

Thirdly, the only country likely to challenge China plans to build 2,000 F-35s. China's J-20s must carry sufficient fuel to chase down F-35s trying to escape with their afterburners.

In conclusion, the J-20 is larger than a F-22 because of China's mission requirements:

1. Avoid necessity of air-refueling

2. Control distant airspace, such as the South China Sea

3. Hunt down enemy aircraft trying to escape with afterburners

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Some websites actually suggests that the larger fuselage is for larger fuel capacity (fly past 1st Island chain) and larger weapon bay for more missiles (to hunt down enemy aircrafts).

Re: Picture of F-117 wreckage in Serbia

Martian said:

Do you think this F-117 debris held important stealth technology secrets? Or does it look like a pile of junk to you too?

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"U.S. Doubts ’99 Jet Debris Gave China Stealth Edge

An American F-117 aircraft was shot down over Serbia in 1999.
(Photo credit: Vladimir Dimitrijevic Tanjug/Associated Press)"

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If people believe scrap metals thats more worthless than 7up pop cans can become the one plane to rule the entire East China Sea region, then we shan't break their fantasies. It's violates their human rights after all

Re: Picture of F-117 wreckage in Serbia

MwRYum said:

It is a pile of junk, though F-117's design limitation spawned from the limited computer power of the CAD design of its time and its mission profile. It is unknown, however, that how much of the RAM coating survived the heat and physical shock without significant chemical change that'd render it worthless to research and re-engineering.

Not to mention how did such samples survived the 5 JDAMs that the USAF dropped onto Chinese embassy...

Though I inclined to believe that J-20 would be using an improved formula of the RAM material to make it economical and serviceable.

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Maybe the F-117 is the result of a poorly rendered polygon, but ended up being produced....54 of them

Ah man! I love this forum so much! So much valuable information. Maybe foreing agencies could donate something?

All this claims about J-20 being bigger than F-22, so as to be able to carry more fuel so that it can had a larger operational radius might not necessary be true.

I mean, we do not actually know what is the engines this aircraft will be carrying in future or even right now and what is the exact fuel consumption of this type of engines. We assume that the engine have the same fuel economy as the engine of F-22, thus when it carried more fuel, it automatically means that the aircraft could fly further.

However, if the consumption is higher, with the size and amount of fuel carried, it might not necessary means that the aircraft could fly further. It might have the same operational radius as the F-22, or maybe have lower operational radius.

Noting that, in order to achieve stealth, J-20 (F-22, F-35), do not carry drop tanks and so I would imagine that the range might not really be too far too. and so one of the most important figure that we missed up was the engine's characteristic. Not just the thrust and power. But the fuel economies of the engines too.

rhino123 said:

Noting that, in order to achieve stealth, J-20 (F-22, F-35), do not carry drop tanks and so I would imagine that the range might not really be too far too. and so one of the most important figure that we missed up was the engine's characteristic. Not just the thrust and power. But the fuel economies of the engines too.

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I have to disagree with you on this matter. F-22 does carry drop tanks when it perform a trans-airport flight. Furthermore, if a stealth fighter carry drop tanks and drop them before get into battle field, I don't think this affect any stealth performance of the aircraft.

siegecrossbow said:

She was responsible for system design of the Taihang Engine (unknown variant but said to be "newest" in the article), which has been approved.

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article says of 'engine with the most advanced digital control system', 'China's most advanced engine control system design', 'Taihang engine control system'
I think it's another praise for WS-10A FADEC creators, but why did you decide that 'newest' Taihang mod is hidden in euphemisms?

maozedong said:

I still don't understand CCTV said that J-20 use original stealth material, it is not coating, so what is it, I don't think it is the stealth material mixed into the plane body.

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It may be that the skin of J-20 is not aluminum, but perhaps fiber reinforced thermoplast, in which case at least some of the radar absorbing material might be on the inside.