J-20 5th Gen Fighter Thread VI

[foxmulder_ms]

J-20 most likely will be able to carry 6 BVR AAMs in future, but it will have to be a new missile.

It will not be able to carry 6 PL-15s, and they will not stack AAMs because stacking AAMs introduces additional more complex deployment pylons as well as causing the risk of backing up missiles deeper in the bay if the lower missile fails to fire.

Yes, J-20 has attachment points in the middle for a third pylon. But it won't be used to carry a PL-15. There is simply insufficient space and PL-15 is too big of a missile to allow six PL-15s to be carried, and the stacking of missiles is unprecedented.

? I am not describing "stacking". The 3rd missile needs to be 20cm or so in front of the current two to clear the fins that is all needed. Since the bay gets shallower in the front from top, it *may* need a slightly taller pylon to clear the rims.

I actually find your guys lack of faith disturbing. #darthvader.

 

[latenlazy]

? I am not describing "stacking". The 3rd missile needs to be 20cm or so in front of the current two to clear the fins that is all needed. Since the bay gets shallower in the front from top, it *may* need a slightly taller pylon to clear the rims.

I actually find your guys lack of faith disturbing. #darthvader.

I mean, I'm okay with lacking faith so long as I have reason but...

 

[Blitzo]

? I am not describing "stacking". The 3rd missile needs to be 20cm or so in front of the current two to clear the fins that is all needed. Since the bay gets shallower in the front from top, it *may* need a slightly taller pylon to clear the rims.

If you're not describing stacking then there is simply insufficient width for another PL-15 to be squeezed between the existing two.

I actually find your guys lack of faith disturbing. #darthvader.

Reason, common sense and logic is more important than faith.

I fully believe that the PLA sees the benefit of 6 BVRAAMs for J-20, but I do not believe PL-15 will be the missile for it.

 

[foxmulder_ms]

Generally speaking, I think there has been enough of a chorus among various big shrimps over the last day or so essentially confirming that J-20 can only hold four PL-15s. I think that makes any debate over whether there might possibly be just enough space between the two missiles for a third to be squeezed in if XYZ was done, to essentially be fruitless.



At this point, I think J-20 carrying 4 PL-15s internally at a maximum should essentially be considered a done deal.

J-20 will probably sooner rather than later be able to carry 6 BVRAAMs internally, but that will be with a new missile.

It can be Xi himself saying "it carries 4", I don't believe it. Look at the pictures I shared of J-20 and F-22. Claiming that is the best packaging they could have came with is a little bit laughable. Commonsense, please.

 

[Blitzo]

It can be Xi himself saying "it carries 4", I don't believe it. Look at the pictures I shared of J-20 and F-22. Claiming that is the best packaging they could have came with is a little bit laughable. Commonsense, please.

... or maybe they designed PL-15 to meet a certain performance benchmark and at the time they couldn't make it any smaller without compromising performance?


If the PLA wanted to make J-20 carry six BVRAAMs they easily could have.

 

[Richard Santos]

It looks to me like PL-15 is far larger than the AIM-120 AMRAAM. So j-20’s ventral weapon bay seems longer and as wide as f-22’s and so should be able to House at least an equal number of AMRAMM sized missiles as the F-22.

 

[Blitzo]

It looks to me like PL-15 is far larger than the AIM-120 AMRAAM. So j-20’s ventral weapon bay seems longer and as wide as f-22’s and so should be able to House at least an equal number of AMRAMM sized missiles as the F-22.

bingo.

PL-12/15 has a larger missile body than AMRAAM. Both are still in the same class of weapon, but PL-12/15 are a fraction larger.

The new BVRAAM would likely have a missile diameter that is smaller as well as smaller fins, allowing six to be carried.

 

[Hyperwarp]

True that an F-22 can carry 6x AIM-120D with a range greater than 180 km, but J-20 carrying 4x missile with a range of 200 km is still impressive.

I think there are provisions for 3x missile per section. Wiring/cables, ejector space, seems to allow 3x missiles.

 

[Blitzo]

True that an F-22 can carry 6x AIM-120D with range greater than 180 km, but J-20 carrying 4x missile with a range of 200 km is still impressive.

I think there are provisions for 3x missile per section. Wiring/cables, ejector space, seem to be allow 3x missiles.

View attachment 49977

If PL-15 has a dual pulse motor and an AESA seeker those would be significant boons to its overall capability vs AIM-120D.

Specifically, the dual pulse motor means that its end game kinematics nearer to its maximum range will be more capable than traditional single pulse motors with higher kP

 

[Biscuits]

It can be Xi himself saying "it carries 4", I don't believe it. Look at the pictures I shared of J-20 and F-22. Claiming that is the best packaging they could have came with is a little bit laughable. Commonsense, please.

You’re comparing a 180km missile with a 300-400km missile. PL 15 is presumably larger.