J-20 5th Gen Fighter Thread V

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Air Force Brat

Brigadier
Super Moderator
The problem with all these comparisons is it is on paper. Your best weapons are always more than just military. They are also PR tools. I assume if you read Chinese news or English news only, you will always end up with a one-sided view. That is what the media does.

In reality J-20 is too new. It is still developing. F-22 vs J-20 will fuel some interesting discussions but there is no way to compare them objectively. I'd rather focus on one or the other, not the comparison, or you end up wasting a lot of time.

all of life is about comparisons, when the Chinese designer was promoting the J-20, what did he do, he compared it to the F-22?

that's how we make decisions, that's why we have a "forum", for the competition to present our own ideas, and test them in the public arena.

when the USAF commissioned building ATF, two competitors were allowed to each build a "proof of concept", same with JSF, two "proof of concept" aircraft were built and allowed to compete, and we the ended up with the best aircraft for the job each time.


If I were to ask, which is the better aircraft?? Mig 15 or North American F-86??? you have an opinion, don't you?
 

bd popeye

The Last Jedi
VIP Professional
Right now in China they are having a large military show called the 11th China International Aviation & Aerospace Exhibition (Airshow China 2016), being held in Zhuhai, Guangdong Province, between Nov. 1-6. It is massive with all sorts of military gear. The US is notably absent. Probably not invited.
Two Chinese J-20 "stealth" aircraft demonstrate their ablity in the 11th China Air Show at Zhuhai airport. This was the J-20 first true public display.[/I]

Two Chinese J-20 "stealth" aircraft demonstrate their ablity in the 11th China Air Show at Zhuhai airport. This was the J-20 first true public display.

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Blackstone

Brigadier
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The first public showing of the Chengdu Aircraft Corporation (CAC) J-20 'fifth-generation' fighter was one of the most anticipated moments of the Airshow China 2016 exhibition, which took place from 1-6 November in Zhuhai, southern Guangdong Province.

However, those hoping to see a demonstration of the capabilities for which the aircraft has become famous through various Chinese online blogs and other open sources came away disappointed.

While two J-20s actually flew at the show during the opening ceremony, neither performed a complete flight routine. The two aircraft, which flew in from an aerodrome in the nearby city of Foshan, initially made a high-speed flyover that looked like the beginning of a two-aircraft demonstration flight.

However, after flying in front of the show's reviewing stand, one of the two aircraft pulled into a short vertical climb for an abbreviated set of manoeuvres and then turned away on to a flight track exiting the aerodrome's airspace.

This J-20 then pulled in behind the second aircraft, which had simply continued on a straight and level course away from the show site after conducting only one fly-by.

The sense of deflated enthusiasm was palpable among the crowd of onlookers as they waited for the aircraft to return, but they did not.

There are believed to be 10 J-20 prototypes, all of which seem to carry out different functions for the J-20 programme. Most recently one of the aircraft was seen conducting a series of tests at a site in Tibet to validate its performance in high and hot climatic conditions.

This has generated a number of questions as to why the aircraft made a rather timid cameo appearance at China's one and only national air show.

"Lack of experience with the aircraft and therefore concern about a mishap cannot be considered a valid reason," said a Russian aerospace executive at the show.
 

weig2000

Captain
Right now in China they are having a large military show called the 11th China International Aviation & Aerospace Exhibition (Airshow China 2016), being held in Zhuhai, Guangdong Province, between Nov. 1-6. It is massive with all sorts of military gear. The US is notably absent. Probably not invited.

I thought the US flew C-17 to the last Zhuhai Airshow. It was quite a scene when C-17, IL-76 and Y-20 were all parked together. I wouldn't think it's because the US was not invited. More likely the US is not interested in sending anything, I suppose.
 

Quickie

Colonel
I need some help understanding why the USAF and USN F-35's don't have TVC any more. The F-22 is such a success. It's still the benchmark for what a 5th gen fighter should be like. One would think they would want to emulate the F-22 design as much as possible. Yet, they decided not to include the TVC in two of the 3 variants of the F-35.

One would expect that they would want to keep the TVC in all 3 variants, just from the standpoint of simplifying the design. And simplifying design and maintenence was a big factor in deciding to use a single frame for all missions. Yet, they designed a completely different engine for B. This seems to defeat the purpose of using the same airframe for all variants.

There must be some kind of penalty associated with the TVC that they specifically design different engines for different variants.

The fact that only the F-35B has the TVC actually suggests that they simply had no choice because of what the USMC wants and were "forced" to put the TVC in...

If you also look at the missions in different branches, you will see an intriguing trend. The USAF and USN F-35's, which will most likely face off with opponent fighters in A2A combats and need to be maneuverable, don't have TVC. The USMC F-35, which will be the least likely to engage in A2A fights, got a TVC. So what is the purpose of the TVC? Most likely not maneuverability?

Another question. Can the F-35B actually use its TVC in fight, or just during take off and landing?

TVC isn't always a necessity for all fighter jets and, in my opinion, this is especially true for canard delta-wing fighter like the J-20, Typhoon, Rafale and Gripen.

Listen to this Eurofighter pilot on what he has to say about TVC.

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AssassinsMace

Lieutenant General
If I recall correctly when the F-22 first appeared at an airshow it was just a flyby much like here. I wasn't there but I remember it on the news described as just a flyby. I believe the same thing happened with the F-117. What were they expecting? A Blue Angels show?


I thought the US flew C-17 to the last Zhuhai Airshow. It was quite a scene when C-17, IL-76 and Y-20 were all parked together. I wouldn't think it's because the US was not invited. More likely the US is not interested in sending anything, I suppose.

Yes remember the infamous story that the US turned on their C-17 radars on the ground and found out the J-31 wasn't at all stealthy? That alone tells you the media doesn't know what they're talking about even when making up lies.
 

Inst

Captain
A quite simple reason could have been that the J-20s were needed for LRIP testing, and acrobatics required training and rehearsal which would have taken time away from real preparations.
 
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