J-20 5th Gen Fighter Thread V
- Thread starter Deino
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So 2017 is off into the "Wild Blue Yonder"?? Merry Christmas gang, lots of nice toys to play with?? so now I wonder if the Flying Mule will bring us a diecast 2016? or 2017, I believe mine is 2001, I'll have to dust it off and see? LOL
Suprisingly its hard to get a clear read from PAK-FA and 2001 in their mock "dogfights", maybe time to try them out in the "test tank"? and see which one flys the best? LOL
Hyperwarp
Captain
Beautiful, Beautiful, I can just imagine how much fun it would be to pull that chick into the vertical! and right out the top of the box? KaBoom!
Merry Christmas Gents, remember I predicted we would see her before Christmas, now if her two sisters make their grand entrance, we will have another box of four, and no doubt call these girls LRIP, or very close to it! A nice present for all of us that love this aeroplane, especially Deino!
That is almost exactly like this illustration on the J-20's wiki page, but much better:
They need to find some good pics for the wiki article. Even J-31 article have pictures.
2016 has got a nice big HUD.
Hyperwarp
Captain
It seems Wiki has some serious copyright allergies. From what I have been told, you must the owner of the pics and waive all sorts of rights on those pics. *SHRUG*
Those rights must have been waived then anyone can use the pictures. They don't want to spend money defending their use of pictures or paying compensation.It seems Wiki has some serious copyright allergies. From what I have been told, you must the owner of the pics and waive all sorts of rights on those pics. *SHRUG*
So, in the last few years there's been a lot of discussion about the existence or lack of existence of a gun on J-20.
I've written an entry on my site discussing it in what I believe to be decent detail, and I use recent pictures released this year which depict the J-20's dorsal, port side to suggest that it is immensely likely that J-20 does have a gun, using logic and picture evidence.
In future if anyone suggests J-20 does not have a gun port, I will simply link them to this entry instead of writing up an original reply every time. It seriously gets tiring.
Full entry:
I've written an entry on my site discussing it in what I believe to be decent detail, and I use recent pictures released this year which depict the J-20's dorsal, port side to suggest that it is immensely likely that J-20 does have a gun, using logic and picture evidence.
In future if anyone suggests J-20 does not have a gun port, I will simply link them to this entry instead of writing up an original reply every time. It seriously gets tiring.
Full entry:
Commentary: J-20 gun armament
Background:
The Chengdu Aircraft Company (CAC) J-20 5th generation stealth fighter made its first flight on 11th of January, 2011. Since then, the aircraft had come under immense scrutiny by Chinese military watchers, general military watchers, defence media, and general media. The existence or non-existence of a gun has been one of the aircraft’s many characteristics which have come into question.
Emergence of the J-20 has prompted a great deal of discussion among defence commentators and military watchers in recent years
As an air to air fighter, the J-20 would be expected to carry an onboard gun for last ditch self defence, and of the many fighter aircraft in the world, the vast majority carry an onboard, integrated gun. Exceptions of the rule do exist, for instance electronic warfare aircraft such as the EA-18G lacks an internal gun, and the F-35B and F-35C variants of the Joint Strike Fighter both also lack an internal gun but have the provision to carry a dedicated external gun pod.
EA-18G Growler, an electronic warfare variant of the F/A-18F Super Hornet. Many minor differences exist between the two, with one of the more significant ones being the removal of the F/A-18F’s internal gun on the EA-18G
The F-35 Joint Strike Fighter family. Of the three variants, only the conventional take off and landing F-35A variant is equipped with an internal gun
However, virtually no air to air fighters today and in the recent past exist without an internal gun, and even among general fighter aircraft it is a rare exception for an aircraft to lack an internal gun.
...
I personally think the gun is greatly overrated in a high altitude super cruising stealth fighter, and only made it into the f-22 because of lingering influence of the fighter mafia. If j-20 doesn't have one, it would mean it's designers were allowed to be more clear headed about what they are designing.
plawolf
Lieutenant General
I otoh, think a gun is critical in the age of 5th gen fighters.
As stealth fighters are inherently harder to detect, engagement ranges are likely to be significantly reduced in a 5th gen v 5th gen fight.
Add in supercruise, and the time rival 5th gens stay in BVR combat is going to be significantly reduced further compared to contemporary jets.
Finally, 5th gen stealth fighters are optimised against X band fire control and terminal guidance radar, the precise type used by BVRAAMs.
That means that the effectiveness and kill ratio of BVRAAMs are likely to be significantly reduced when used against 5th gens even if you could detect them far enough out to use such weapons.
Add in the fact that all 5th gens have a very limited internal missile load and that all means that it is highly likely that in the event of a massed air brawl between rival 5th gens, many if not most of those 5th gens will make it into WVR combat.
With only two WVRAAMs carried internally apiece, at best, a 5th gen without a gun is simply going to be in big trouble when fighting against enemy 5th gens with guns. Hell, I would go as far as to suggest a 5th gen without WVRAAMs or a gun is simply going to become a sitting duck if faced against enemy 5th gens that have both.
I think guns will only get more important going forwards, especially as new technology is developed and becomes available.
Depending on timeframe, it is entirely possible that 6th or 7th gen fighters will start relying on guns as their primary weapon if rail guns and energy weapons (and their power generation/storage solutions) could be minituarised enough to fit on fighters.
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