J-20 5th Gen Fighter Thread IV (Closed to posting)

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latenlazy

Brigadier
Might as well develop an external gunpod for it.

That is certainly one option, but not one without some penalties. It really depends on what they determine to be the frequency of use. The B and C variants of the F-35 use the gun pod solution because they have fewer mission profiles that would make having a gun prudent, especially in joint missions with the air force (and because the A variant has some extra space where the lift fan would have been installed).

Designing space for a gun inside the fuselage and not using it doesn't sound as wasteful as it might seem. Space penalties would be minimal if they can make that space interchangeable with a fuel tank. I can't speak to how practical this would be of course, since I'm not a fighter plane engineer, but good designs assess their options.
 

chuck731

Banned Idiot
looking over the Entire line of known Fighters produced by the PLAAF, None of them Feature gun pods. Every fighter interceptor features a internal cannon Normally 23mm. Chuck even there next latest fighters the J10 and J11 and J15 all carry internal cannons 23mm for J10 30mm For J11 and J15.


J10, j11 and j15 are all of the 1970 generation of fighters that owes their guiding light to now almost 50 year old experiences of Vietnamese and 1967 war. Even if j10 is chronologically later it was still designed to catch up to that generation.

Even the f-22 was designed in the late 1980s when the US was seriously behind the state of the art in short range AAM, didn't know it was behind, and didn't know how good latest soviet short range AAMs have gotten.

I think military services are particularly vulnerable to having a wrenching experience from the past disproportionally effect it's view of the future. The lack of a gun in Vietnam had been a gulling experience for the US, as a result it has become religious dogma that gun is vital for all time. But I think that is not so, especially when when takes into consideration the weight and design penalties of incorporating the gun.

BTW, the laser countermeasures now bing developed to counter short range IR missiles would work just as effectively against a pilot trying to point a gun. Furthermore, while the pilot firing the defeated IR missile has the options to fire another, the pilot who tried to draw a bead on the target would be blinded and effectively killed for his troubles.
 
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vesicles

Colonel
In the age of all aspect stealth, when detection and engagement ranges between 5th gen opponents are likely to be vastly reduced compared to previous generations; when advances in countermeasures and the RCS reducing features of stealth fighters make the ability of radar guided missiles to successfully lock-on and destroy stealth targets highly questionable; and when 5 gen fighters are themselves only carrying a pair of IR guided missiles each normally, ullagising the end of the gun seems pretty...illogical, to put it politely.

Coming back to the golden age of dog fighting!!!
 

by78

General
J10, j11 and j15 are all of the 1970 generation of fighters that owes their guiding light to now almost 50 year old experiences of Vietnamese and 1967 war. Even if j10 is chronologically later it was still designed to catch up to that generation.

So why are the F-35 and F-22 equipped with guns/gun pods?

I'm now employing Aristotelian logic... assumptions, assumptions.
 

vesicles

Colonel
So guns jam, and guns miss. Do you see infantrymen issued with pikes?

Com'on, Chuck. Bayonet/knife is equivalent to a pike in terms of advancement of the weapon, isn't it? In fact, invention of knife was actually before the pike, making the knife even more ancient and more primitive than the pike. Yet, modern soldiers still use them...
 

chuck731

Banned Idiot
So why are the F-35 and F-22 equipped with guns/gun pods?

I'm now employing Aristotelian logic... assumptions, assumptions.

Because everyone make mistakes, and/or are vulnerable to pressure of rhetoric such as those you bring to bear here for sake of smoother path through the halls that control the purse strings.
 

Equation

Lieutenant General
With today's technology guns could be made lighter with less space required internally for today's fighter jets, along with the rounds. Of course they don't carry as much but it's an added option for the pilot.
 
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