J-10 Thread IV

[siegecrossbow]

I still don't get why Indonesia would want J-10A, if they get any J-10.

Those are old planes that have been out of production for at least a decade so parts would be an issue, they use a different Al-31 variant to any Flankers, so out goes most of the maintenance benefit.

And most importantly, they were most likely ridden hard by the PLAAF units flying them, considering China's severe lack of 4th gen fighters during their time of introduction, so they're most likely structurally shot. Even considering PLAAF's relatively good maintenance track record, I don't see how it's a good idea.

ID would need to get it structurally refreshed, then MLUed with new radar, presumably new avionics, etc. All that expense (modern avionics are expensive, not to mention sctructural MLU) for a second hand aricraft? Not worth it IMO.

P.S. I had the same attitude towards the ex-Qatari Mirage 2000-5s, the ID govt came back to their senses and cancelled that project, but now comes BS 2.0 -_-

P.S 2. If anything, ID Air force is much more in a dire need of any special sensor aircraft, be it AWACS, EW, etc. Otherwise, those J-10As would still be food in an actual real war.

J-10S could retrofit WS-10B. That said I agree with your assessment.

 

[SanWenYu]

Is there a chance that China wants to sell those J-10A jets, retrofitted, cheaply, like at a symbolic price, only to lure Indonesia away from buying from the US?

If Indonesia is to be flying American fighter jets, the US will have the opportunity to use these aircrafts in a war against China. If Indonesia buys from China instead, it will be a turn of the table for China.

 

[Tomboy]

I still don't get why Indonesia would want J-10A, if they get any J-10.

Those are old planes that have been out of production for at least a decade so parts would be an issue, they use a different Al-31 variant to any Flankers, so out goes most of the maintenance benefit.

This isn't true at all, Al-31FN still uses the same hot section as Al-31F series engines of the same era. Also, J-10A parts are likely still in production as PLAAF still needs to maintain a large fleet of them for the near future. All the issues you've listed are basically non-issues if you really think about them. J-10As were made all the way up to 2014 which means the youngest airframes are only a little over 10 years old, these airframes could still serve for another 20 years(especially since smaller airforces does not fly as frequently as PLAAF) if maintained properly. Even if J-10A MLU is nearly the same price of a J-10CE（Likely cheaper), J-10A MLU would still be a better option for Indonesia due to it being available at this moment, if they order now, they could get flying J-10A with MLU'd avionics in possibly months while if they were to order new J-10Cs they'd be waiting for years especially for a large order of 42 aircrafts and the recent explosion of popularity of the J-10CE.

 

[Blitzo]

I don't think there's any reason to talk too much about the idea of Indonesia buying J-10s (of any variant) unless something actually credible and solid emerges.


If anything, for most export sales they generally seem not worthy of discussion to me until they are literally confirmed -- e.g.: hardware delivered on the ground to the customer's soil.

 

[The Observer]

This isn't true at all, Al-31FN still uses the same hot section as Al-31F series engines of the same era. Also, J-10A parts are likely still in production as PLAAF still needs to maintain a large fleet of them for the near future. All the issues you've listed are basically non-issues if you really think about them. J-10As were made all the way up to 2014 which means the youngest airframes are only a little over 10 years old, these airframes could still serve for another 20 years(especially since smaller airforces does not fly as frequently as PLAAF) if maintained properly. Even if J-10A MLU is nearly the same price of a J-10CE（Likely cheaper), J-10A MLU would still be a better option for Indonesia due to it being available at this moment, if they order now, they could get flying J-10A with MLU'd avionics in possibly months while if they were to order new J-10Cs they'd be waiting for years especially for a large order of 42 aircrafts and the recent explosion of popularity of the J-10CE.

Then there's another issue that's pretty prevalent with most govt really, the problem of cost cutting, corruption, and lax due diligence.

Hard flown J-10A needing Structural & Avionics MLU just seem like prime victim for governmental cost cutting and corruption. Delayed/cancelled structural MLU in the spririt of "Surely it'll be fine~", cut down avionics MLU rendering the planes less effective/ plain ineffective, as well as notorious ID corruption swallowing any govt project budget just sounds like a recipe for disaster. Add to that ID aviation maintenance industry's questionable safety track record, I don't think it's a good idea to purchase anything used, period.

 

[talonn]

What's the price difference between j-10a and j-10ce?

 

[gelgoog]

I suspect if a deal to buy used aircraft happens it will be because of a need for immediate delivery.

 

[sutton999]

J10AG is AESA and WS10, zero chance AL31,

J10c order likely on a queue, get familiar with J10 and adopt J10c later.

 

[siegecrossbow]

J-10C chief designer Wang Haifeng (also chief designer of J-36) signing models at his Alma Mater:

 

[sutton999]

Militarily Indonesia has committed to the west camp, not only Rafael but also submarine and frigates. All of which China has offered.

Now a bit panicked, Indonesia need backup. Choice offered is between Jf17c or J10ag. PL15e will be available as a good gesture.