Israeli preparing for 'all out' war (Ground Invasion)

bd popeye

The Last Jedi
VIP Professional
I suppose that is true, but I am less and less willing to give Israel the benefit of the doubt with regards to extraordinary incidents of civilian casualties like this one.

Nope my friend war sucks..

Hamas, Hezbollah keep their families in harms way in order to ensure civilian casualties and make the Israelis look barbaric. They have no respect for human life. None. They want you everyone you know to conform to their way of thinking, religion or die. they will do anything to accomplish this. It's that simple.

While I don't agree 100% with what Ernest Hemingway said: "No war is just. Ask the infantry and the dead." Still great words to ponder.

It is not my intention to offend anyone with my statement.
 
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unknauthr

Junior Member
It seems to me that this incident at least shows that Israel is not doing EVERYTHING it can to prevent civilian casualties, or even everything within reason.

Friendly fire is a sad, and unfortunate reality of war. It seems like only yesterday the death of Italian intelligence officer Nicola Calipari - at the hands of US soldiers in Iraq - was at the top of the news:
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Sad as it is, these things happen when you're on a battlefield.
 

The_Zergling

Junior Member
I feel that for the most part, news coverage of this conflict (speaking from a US perspective) seems a bit... one-sided. I'm not sure if anyone else has the same feeling though - is this support for Israel practically universal or something?
 

Player 0

Junior Member
^No, i've been watching Al Jazeera, and they're fairly anti-Israel and pro-Palestine, though to their credit they don't outrightly support Hamas, they support the peopel of Palestine and the protestors supporting them, and regularly pointing out the unwillingness for neighboring Arab governments and the UN to resolve this issue.
 

MrClean

New Member
Yeah, about the collateral damage. If Hamas wouldn't use elementry schools and mosques and hospitals as bases to launch rockets into Israel, then maybe there wouldn't be quite so many civillian casulties. But as BD said, they have no respect for human life, whether it be women or children, no respect for life what so ever.
 

ccL1

New Member
I don't think Hamas even has a choice. They must fight Israel in the way that maximizes benefit for themselves. Modern warfare is often ugly like that. Hamas would get annihilated otherwise, if they left themselves open and set up bases and launching pads in areas away from urban life. Israel's intelligence on Hamas and Palestine in general is just too great.

Besides, it's a great propaganda tool for them too. Let's say Israel hits a school and kills 2 or 3 militants while also killing 20 school children as an example. The news goes around Palestine and the rest of the world that 20 school children are killed by Israeli missiles. The Palestinians look like the victims, and Israel looks like the bad guys.

Frankly, I think Hamas is running a better PR and propaganda campaign than Israel is right now.
 

alwaysfresh

New Member
"The Irish Anti-War Movement has announced plans for another protest in Dublin this Saturday against the Israeli bombardment of the Gaza Strip."

"More than 50,000 Egyptian have protested in the city of Alexandria against Israel's assault on Gaza, ...

"Egypt and Jordan are the only Arab nations with diplomatic relations with Israel. "

"Angry Palestinian protesters have clashed with Israeli police in Hebron in the occupied West Bank."

"Israel had placed the West Bank on a 48-hour lockdown, prohibiting movement into and out of the Palestinian territory until Saturday except in emergency cases."

"South Africa called on the United Nations to stand together in condemning the escalation of violence on the part of Israel"
"Six people were arrested on Thursday evening during a pro-Palestinian demonstration in the centre of Utrecht, one of the Netherlands' major cities. They were apprehended for threatening behaviour and for refusing to follow police orders."

"Malaysia's leader on Thursday called for sanctions on Israel over its lethal military strikes on Gaza, saying the international community has a "moral duty" to save the Palestinian people."

"till, the proposal is unlikely to see the light of day as any sanctions must be approved by the U.N. Security Council where the U.S., Israel's main ally, has veto power."

"Tel Aviv quickly continued its attacks on the Gaza Strip with 30 air strikes in the pre-dawn Friday morning, with new reports of the Israeli use of phosphorous shells."

"The Israeli security cabinet says the Gaza offensive will continue despite a UN Security Council resolution calling for an urgent ceasefire."

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"In the conflict, so far 770 Palestinians and 14 Israelis have been killed, with thousands wounded"

"The Security Council resolution was approved last night by a 14-0 vote, with the United States abstaining."

"The Israeli army said that 30 rockets were fired into southern Israel on Friday morning, injuring one person."

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"People spend almost 24-hours a day indoors, listening to the news on the radio – if they have batteries."

"The US House of Representatives has voted to endorse a resolution backing Israel in its offensive in Gaza, in which at least 780 Palestinians have been killed. The body passed Friday's resolution "recognising Israel's right to defend itself against attacks from Gaza" by 390 votes to five."

"The top U.N. human rights official called on Friday for independent investigations into possible war crimes committed by Israeli forces in the Gaza Strip."

"Israel has vowed to continue its 12-day military campaign until it is satisfied that Hamas will be unable to rearm itself by smuggling weaponry through cross-border tunnels from Egypt."

"The Netherlands, Denmark and Turkey said Wednesday they would be willing to contribute to an international force that would patrol the Gaza-Egypt border to prevent smuggling."

"Seven Israeli soldiers and three civilians have died in the conflict. Four of the soldiers were killed by errant shells fired by Israeli forces."

"Tens of thousands of Iraqis protested against Israel's offensive in the Gaza Strip on Friday and powerful Shi'ite cleric Moqtada al-Sadr called for revenge attacks on the Jewish state's strongest ally the United States."

"A Gaza health official says a Ukrainian woman has been killed by an Israeli tank shell. She is the first foreign national to die in nearly two weeks of violence in the Palestinian territory."

"The U.S. military has sought to hire a merchant ship to deliver ammunition to Israel this month, tender documents show, but the Pentagon said the shipment was not linked to the conflict in the Gaza Strip."
 

The_Zergling

Junior Member
mrclean said:
Yeah, about the collateral damage. If Hamas wouldn't use elementry schools and mosques and hospitals as bases to launch rockets into Israel, then maybe there wouldn't be quite so many civillian casulties. But as BD said, they have no respect for human life, whether it be women or children, no respect for life what so ever.

I respectfully disagree with this mindset - the whole 'Hamas/Palestinians are inhuman' thing, because it's just too simplified to be useful and paints the world into an inaccurate good/evil dichotomy that makes it hard to make good nuanced decisions.

I don't think Hamas even has a choice. They must fight Israel in the way that maximizes benefit for themselves. Modern warfare is often ugly like that. Hamas would get annihilated otherwise, if they left themselves open and set up bases and launching pads in areas away from urban life. Israel's intelligence on Hamas and Palestine in general is just too great.

Besides, it's a great propaganda tool for them too. Let's say Israel hits a school and kills 2 or 3 militants while also killing 20 school children as an example. The news goes around Palestine and the rest of the world that 20 school children are killed by Israeli missiles. The Palestinians look like the victims, and Israel looks like the bad guys.

Frankly, I think Hamas is running a better PR and propaganda campaign than Israel is right now.

Perhaps around the world, but inside the US Israel is definitely favored in the media - it's not even close.
 

Finn McCool

Captain
Registered Member
I respectfully disagree with this mindset - the whole 'Hamas/Palestinians are inhuman' thing, because it's just too simplified to be useful and paints the world into an inaccurate good/evil dichotomy that makes it hard to make good nuanced decisions.

Yes I have to agree with Zergling here, one cannot simply say "Well Hamas is bad and hides behind civilians so that gives the Israelis the right to be as trigger happy as they want". I'm not a Palestinian supporter, I hope Israel smashes Hamas as much as the next guy. But what annoys me, is that the Isrealis seem to be taking a cavalier attitude to some situations. Shoot first and ask questions later. Do they not realize that, given the choice between shooting at a UN school and killing two or three Hamas fighters and 40 schoolchildren and just letting those fighters go, that letting them go is OBVIOUSLY the best choice. I refuse to believe that Israel is "Taking all necessary measures" simply because they say they are. The US was in similar situations in Iraq, some of them worse than this, and they managed to accomplish their goals with less civilian casualties. The Battle of Najaf comes to mind.
 

pla101prc

Senior Member
I don't think Hamas even has a choice. They must fight Israel in the way that maximizes benefit for themselves. Modern warfare is often ugly like that. Hamas would get annihilated otherwise, if they left themselves open and set up bases and launching pads in areas away from urban life. Israel's intelligence on Hamas and Palestine in general is just too great.

Besides, it's a great propaganda tool for them too. Let's say Israel hits a school and kills 2 or 3 militants while also killing 20 school children as an example. The news goes around Palestine and the rest of the world that 20 school children are killed by Israeli missiles. The Palestinians look like the victims, and Israel looks like the bad guys.

Frankly, I think Hamas is running a better PR and propaganda campaign than Israel is right now.

israel is definitely losing this PR war righ now...i think this is mostly a result of europe's disagreement with the US. the only news media outlet that gave israel credit for what they do right now is fox...and even they cant avoid talkin about the collateral damage. all we see on the news everyday is mounting civilian casualties as a result of israel's ruthless bombing. honestly the more israel do this, the stronger these terrorist groups are gonna get. israel knows this. but it seems that they cannot stop right now, its like riding on a tiger's back, if they stop, they lose. but if they go on, it is not in their best interest either. israel has been sending mixed messages, talking about how they think they are nearing their objectives...prolly as a result of the US bailing on them on the UN vote. now the US is turning back and giving them support again by shipping a crap load of ammos. but even so the US still cannot achieve its aim, because iran didnt move a muscle...which is very smart.
 
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