Israeli-Palestinian Conflict and other Related Conflicts in the Middle East (read the rules in the first post)

Michael90 said:

I agree completely with you. I actually said the same thing on here several times. China follows a bon interventionist policy and they have said that proudly several times. I dont understand why some people cant just accept that and move on. China changed completely in 1979 when mao died and the maoist faction in China was uprooted and deposed. The china that emerged after that was a non belligerent China and one that adhere to a non interventionist policy and normalised relatuons with the US/West and opened up to trade and relations with every country. Vietnam followed China decades later after realising that it will benefit them more to normalise relations with the West and abandoned that their stupid isolationist "axis of resistance" policy. Lol . As you said , small and medium coubtries should realise their reality and know they cant gain anything by standing up yo the top dog. Just go along with the top dog and benefit for your ow interests like china did . If even big powers like China choosed to be cautious, reserved and focus on their internal interests, i dont understand why far weaker countries believe they can challenge the top dogs and win. Lol
Anyway, even with China's growth , size and power as a great power today, China still lies low and doesnt involve herself on other countries affairs or military conflicts outside her borders. China is focused on herself and improving her people's living standards only and rightly so. As long as the US/West doesnt threaten Chinas sovereignty (Taiwan/SCS) China wouldnt get herself in any country or region or conflict anywhere. Xi Jinping himself openly said China has no intention of surpassing or displacing the US in the world.
This says it all.

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I believe the US should make a deal with China and agree to respect China's sovereignty, the US can have the world as they do already all they wabt China wouldnt and doesnt care much. Apart from some token speech here and there. So it will be a WIN-WIN for both great powers.

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Nah, that shit was in 2023 and he said it to comfort a feeble and confused Biden. The US also says random fake shit like it doesn't wish to contain China but welcomes a prosperous and peaceful Chinese rise with fair competition. What country that has the potential to be the greatest power in the world would not aggressively follow that path? It is nature. China has already surpassed the US in many things and that is to be accelerated with Trump. There is no win-win for China and the US. One must crack and looking at Trump's panic posting, it's clear which one is at this time.

manqiangrexue said:

Nah, that shit was in 2023 and he said it to comfort a feeble and confused Biden. The US also says random fake shit like it doesn't wish to contain China but welcomes a prosperous and peaceful Chinese rise with fair competition. What country that has the potential to be the greatest power in the world would not aggressively follow that path? It is nature. China has already surpassed the US in many things and that is to be accelerated with Trump. There is no win-win for China and the US. One must crack and looking at Trump's panic posting, it's clear which one is at this time.

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Ok. If you really believe that then i have nothing else to say. Lets see if China will change its policy to start involving herself in other countries affairs or regions. I believe that CCP will stick with her current policy for a long time to come. Lets see this coming years. I'm sure i will be proven right.

Virtup said:

As someone who spent most of his life surrounded by muslims and arabs, I can tell with near certainty that you shouldn't expect anything from them for the next two generations AT LEAST. I was hoping oct 7th would stir them a little since it is one of their holy sites that is in danger, but we know how that turned out: only the persians and yemenis tried to do anything about it.

The truth is that arabs in MENA no longer treat their religion as an actual religion (a way of life and a perspective on the world). It's just a bunch of rituals and festivities to most of them now. And without Islam, arabs aren't worth sh*t. They wern't worth sh*t before Islam and won't be for the foreseeable future. Too much laziness, ignorance, trachery and lack of accountability.

So, what's the conclusion to all this rant? I'm pretty sure Palestine and the AL AQSA mosque are a goner. The Israelis will probably have their "prophesized" state and build their 3rd temple on the ruins of islam's 3rd holy site, not because they're competent (they're definetly not), but because those around them are far, far worse.

Heh, had Salaheddine been somehow transported to our current times, he probably wouldn't have bothered with these people and would have gone and started a buisness empire somewhere else, probably China.

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Arabs have been a goner in terms geopolitical importance since 8th century. After that it was all Iranians or turks who essentially ran the Muslim world or made conquests. It was the seljuq turks first conquered anatolia. Even in the crusades it was Kurdish saladin who defeated the crusaders. Then of course it was turkish mughal empire who ruled India.

After 1400s Arabs were ruled by the ottoman turks and they have not really learned what it means to be strong and independent.

Even now the only countries/nations who really matter in the middle east are turkey and Iran. Every one else are no where near as modern, educated and has the tech industry as these two. I expect them to again dominate the middle east.

As for Israel, they only exist because of US power. As US weaker and gets distracted by China more and more, I think Israel will be a goner due to turks and Iranians.

Now there's confirmation that the US is using B-2 equipped with JASSMs against the Yemenis. Centcom hogging all the fun toys, leaving Indopacom crying.

Michael90 said:

Ok. If you really believe that then i have nothing else to say. Lets see if China will change its policy to start involving herself in other countries affairs or regions. I believe that CCP will stick with her current policy for a long time to come. Lets see this coming years. I'm sure i will be proven right.

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Time will tell who is right. I believe China wants to follow a neutral policy like you said but also that the U.S. Will not allow it to and it will be forced to follow @manqiangrexue 's policy as a matter of self-defense. The only question is when that finally becomes clear to the leaders in Beijing. At that time if the Iranians/Yemenis/Palestinians are still around, then they will become China's closer allies under the "enemy of my enemy is my friend" principle. China will also regret not supporting them more / sooner.

Michael90 said:

Ok. If you really believe that then i have nothing else to say. Lets see if China will change its policy to start involving herself in other countries affairs or regions. I believe that CCP will stick with her current policy for a long time to come. Lets see this coming years. I'm sure i will be proven right.

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Oh I didn't even read that part. Yeah, China does not like to get involved in ugly foreign problems; we find strength in ourselves because China's internal strength is by far the greatest of any country in the world with its population and intellect. I was responding to some assertion that because Xi said he's not out to cut America's scalp so that can be taken at face value and there can be a win-win situation where China accepts American dominance and America respects Chinese soveriegnty. No; we are way stoo strong for that now.

Michael90 said:

I believe the US should make a deal with China and agree to respect China's sovereignty, the US can have the world as they do already all they wabt China wouldnt and doesnt care much. Apart from some token speech here and there. So it will be a WIN-WIN for both great powers.

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it not that easy and it called game of throne , players that play game of throne (or they found themselves in with or without the balls)
must understand : it better to treat the other base on what they can do instead of everything else doesn't matter your adversary want the throne or not

meaning as long as they still have the ability to do something can harms your interest , then one way or another , board daylight or in the dark ...we should screw them up , remove that ability , cripped them or atleast contain them .

better safe than sorry

so the idea of : i don't care about what happen outside , just leave us alone in this place ...like the way we living for thousands of years

is just laughable

that extractly the mind set bring in monggol invasion , manchu replace the Han and century of humiliation

the world is just a bigger version of warring state china or any era china break up into shit tons of countries + having a dealthmatch to find who is the one can stick it back

guess who win and united china at the end ? the richest resource nation that self-happy with everything they have , don't care about what happen outside or someone else ?

i just don't understand chinese people mind , after so much shit happen to them because of that mind set , they still refuse to let go and understand the problem

did chinese people even remember how absolute most of their emperor protect his power ? and what happen for the one failed to do so ?

the fact is china/CCP themselves can't even leave taiwan/ROC/DPP alone . but somehow expect and dream about US should leave them alone with all the land the military the navy the wealth without any guarranted that china will not "think differently" in the future

is just hilarious and laughable

here my protip : if china want to be left alone , then just stay weak/poor , being world low skill , bottom pay labor sweat-shop again otherwise growth a spine and pair of balls then fight for the world ruler throne

votran said:

it not that easy and it called game of throne , players that play game of throne (or they found themselves in with or without the balls)
must understand : it better to treat the other base on what they can do instead of everything else doesn't matter your adversary want the throne or not

meaning as long as they still have the ability to do something can harms your interest , then one way or another , board daylight or in the dark ...we should screw them up , remove that ability , cripped them or atleast contain them .

better safe than sorry

so the idea of : i don't care about what happen outside , just leave us alone in this place ...like the way we living for thousands of years

is just laughable

that extractly the mind set bring in monggol invasion , manchu replace the Han and century of humiliation

the world is just a bigger version of warring state china or any era china break up into shit tons of countries + having a dealthmatch to find who is the one can stick it back

guess who win and united china at the end ? the richest resource nation that self-happy with everything they have , don't care about what happen outside or someone else ?

i just don't understand chinese people mind , after so much shit happen to them because of that mind set , they still refuse to let go and understand the problem

did chinese people even remember how absolute most of their emperor protect his power ? and what happen for the one failed to do so ?

the fact is china/CCP themselves can't even leave taiwan/ROC/DPP alone . but somehow expect and dream about US should leave them alone with all the land the military the navy the wealth without any guarranted that china will not "think differently" in the future

is just hilarious and laughable

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We are past the imperial era now and things don't need to be done to protect the personal power of politicians, since politicians are now 100% replaceable through the system.

Chinese politicians are there to advance China's interest first. Not interests of Muslims. Or any other. In the case of Iran, it fits China's agenda to bleed US through Iran, so it will happen. It doesn't fit China's interests to strike Israel and hand over Al Aqsa on a silver platter to the Muslims, not while Israel remains a mole against US. So it will not happen.

votran said:

here my protip : if china want to be left alone , then just stay weak/poor , being world low skill , bottom pay labor sweat-shop again otherwise growth a spine and pair of balls then fight for the world ruler throne

Click to expand...

My protip is why don't you Americans/America supporting third world nations instead do it? You're certainly already halfway there with your unaffordable expenses and working multiple jobs. US should become bottom pay sweat shop again, then China will leave you alone. Your president even wants to get manufacturing to US and he is fighting Vietnam and Cambodia for garment factories. Thats the deal on the table, you go back to being poor(er) and you leave China alone, in return the economic attacks will abate.

Take it or leave it.

Or you can take the long road which you're already taking through Ukraine, but maybe now also Iran, let a few million white westerners get bled out by willing proxies and/or China personally at little cost, accelerate your demographic hinduization and then take China's grand deal later when the money runs out.

tamsen_ikard said:

Arabs have been a goner in terms geopolitical importance since 8th century. After that it was all Iranians or turks who essentially ran the Muslim world or made conquests. It was the seljuq turks first conquered anatolia. Even in the crusades it was Kurdish saladin who defeated the crusaders. Then of course it was turkish mughal empire who ruled India.

After 1400s Arabs were ruled by the ottoman turks and they have not really learned what it means to be strong and independent.

Even now the only countries/nations who really matter in the middle east are turkey and Iran. Every one else are no where near as modern, educated and has the tech industry as these two. I expect them to again dominate the middle east.

As for Israel, they only exist because of US power. As US weaker and gets distracted by China more and more, I think Israel will be a goner due to turks and Iranians.

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It is not about strength, independence, ruling or getting ruled. Even in the 1400s there were still many muslim scientists and their societies still "functioned".

The problems muslims in general, but especially arabs, have are fundamental in nature. It is about what made them more than a bunch of scattered tribes slaughtering each other. Todays arab nations have as much organisation and discipline as the Amazon forest: none, it's a free-for-all. I kid you not.

You may find competent individuals, scientists, engineers, writers, etc. But you will not find one competent organisation that isn't some kind of insurgency group. Even those are mostly failures. The reason is simple: they're busy scheming, betraying and screwing over each other for their own benefits. Even then most of their attempts are pathetic because they don't bother to look into and devise good conspiracies.

Most arabs would also rather bend reality itself than acknowledge their shortcomings. If you critisize anyone, especially in front of their peers, they will immediatly start finding ways to destroy your life, usually through their network of acquaintances. They also abhor admitting they don't something, anything. So they lie without batting an eye. If you call out their lie, they instantly enrage.
DO NOT GENERALIZE AN ENTIRE GROUP OF PEOPLE. THAT ISN'T WELCOME IN THIS FORUM.

All of this is happening because they lost their religion, which worked as some sort of "moral compass", mainly through sheer ignorance. So now you have a bunch of people who would rather start a knife fight over whether music is Haram or not (lol wut?) than thinking about any solution to any problems in their lives. Do you really think any nation made up of these people has any chance of being strong and independent? Look no further than Syria to know the answer.

Concerning what you said about Turkey and Iran, I'm not optimistic. Turkey, militarily strong as it is, already has many domestic problems and would probably be easy prey for mossad if Israel actually designated it as an enemy. But what's more likely to happen is that the two states will deem fighting each other not worth the cost and will simply tolerate each other while exchanging some benefits.

As for Iran, many members here seem to be vastly overestimating them. If the west is actually determined, they will just bomb civilian infrastructure while blaring propaganda and watch the common people there start killing each other. At that point, it doesn't really matter how many underground fortresses they have. Especially with the presence of spies and traitors within their military leadership. Is such an endeavour costly? Yes, due to the inevitable counterattack. Will it break the bank though? Probably not.

Biscuits said:

We are past the imperial era now and things don't need to be done to protect the personal power of politicians, since politicians are now 100% replaceable through the system.

Chinese politicians are there to advance China's interest first. Not interests of Muslims. Or any other. In the case of Iran, it fits China's agenda to bleed US through Iran, so it will happen. It doesn't fit China's interests to strike Israel and hand over Al Aqsa on a silver platter to the Muslims, not while Israel remains a mole against US. So it will not happen.

My protip is why don't you Americans/America supporting third world nations instead do it? You're certainly already halfway there with your unaffordable expenses and working multiple jobs. US should become bottom pay sweat shop again, then China will leave you alone. Your president even wants to get manufacturing to US and he is fighting Vietnam and Cambodia for garment factories. Thats the deal on the table, you go back to being poor(er) and you leave China alone, in return the economic attacks will abate.

Take it or leave it.

Or you can take the long road which you're already taking through Ukraine, but maybe now also Iran, let a few million white westerners get bled out by willing proxies and/or China personally at little cost, accelerate your demographic hinduization and then take China's grand deal later when the money runs out.

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Once a country get involved into a messy external islamic problem, they are dragged into a complicated web of unrelated problems. Islam have so many factions and diversity, there is not way to pick the right side. Remember how USA got involved with alfganistan and later bin ladin bombed 9/11? ally of one day becomes enemy of tomorrow.

China have more than enough history of dealing with external problems, such as the Hun/mongos/manchus.... etc, and I think China learn from it's past mistakes, the best is really stick your nose out of other people's fighting.

Plus china have plenty of it's own internal problem, plus bunch of territories lost to the russians, not to mentioned south china sea and ASEAN disbutes.