Indian Military News, Reports, Data, etc.

Deino · Feb 8, 2015

A Bar Brother said:
They will start construction of TD-1 and TD-2 by the middle of the year if the IAF accepts the design and the engine choice. I would keep my fingers crossed though. The IAF wouldn't want this program in a hurry because of Rafale and FGFA. It is possible the actual program may eventually start the next financial year.

Sorry, but that's a huge contradiction: on the one side You say that they have not even decided which engine would be used - I agree with that - and then You say they start building TD-1 and -2 this year.

So either this is simply wrong or if true another proof that there is something severely going wrong at HAL ... I would be surprised if they have already begun with detailed development work and final design review.

Maybe a mock-up will be build but surely not a real airframe.

Deino

aksha · Feb 8, 2015

A Bar Brother said:
I am hoping they choose the EJ2x0 for the TDs as of now. The next best choice would be GE F414EDE/EPE.

whom do you they think they will partner for joint devpt. of engines

Moreover, even as various aspects of stealth technology are being worked upon, the fact remains that the AMCA test vehicles will be powered by imported low bypass turbofan engines. According to Dr Tamilmani, an engine selection process is not just underway, but is actually being hastened. Six engine original equipment makers (OEMs) have been sounded out for what is essentially an upgraded & up-rated version of an existing engine that could provide 110 kilo newton (KN) of wet thrust. "The RFPs will be sent out by April 2015, and in another eight months we will firm up our choice of engine to power the AMCA," says Dr Tamilmani. "We however have to do a lot work on our own to develop thrust vectoring for the AMCA," he adds.
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A Bar Brother · Feb 8, 2015

Deino said:
Sorry, but that's a huge contradiction: on the one side You say that they have not even decided which engine would be used - I agree with that - and then You say they start building TD-1 and -2 this year.

A lot of our engine related news is classified. The design of a new engine has started, even though it has not yet been officially revealed. There are clues available, GTRE has a tender out for a 3 stage Blisk JV.

Oh, and I didn't say TD-1 and 2 will be built this year, it was the article which said that. The TDs will be based on an engine already available in the market. I agree that starting TD production contradicts logic, that's why I said I don't see anything happening until next year. I generally don't believe a lot in DRDO's time schedule. My basic rule of thumb when dealing with DRDO is, "I believe it when I see it."

Maybe a mock-up will be build but surely not a real airframe.

Are you talking about a ground test vehicle? I don't believe that is planned though. The first AMCA will be TD-1, like it was for LCA. Mockups for development is pointless.

aksha · Feb 8, 2015

Deino said:
Sorry, but that's a huge contradiction: on the one side You say that they have not even decided which engine would be used - I agree with that - and then You say they start building TD-1 and -2 this year.

So either this is simply wrong or if true another proof that there is something severely going wrong at HAL ... I would be surprised if they have already begun with detailed development work and final design review.

Maybe a mock-up will be build but surely not a real airframe.

Deino

well , the final design which has been frozen went through wind tunnel testing at CALSPAN
in USA, in late 2014.

but we are likely to recieve further clarifacation at aero india which is 9 days from today

A Bar Brother · Feb 8, 2015

aksha said:
whom do you they think they will partner for joint devpt. of engines

It is yet unknown. GTRE is negotiating with GE and Eurojet. GTRE wants to further develop the F414 with GE under the DTTI scheme. The ToT will be limited to 50% though.

Saturn wants to join in, but MoD/IAF is not too keen on depending on the Russians even though they provide a much higher level of ToT at a lower cost. The Russians have their hands in too many Indian projects already.

It is too early to say anything.

Deino · Feb 8, 2015

o.k. that is new to me Thanks a lot !

But ... and I know several Indian Aviation enthusiasts don't want to hear that or they won't like me for that: it is again too much, too soon with too less fixed concepts ...

I can understand that they have all these latest gems on their wish-list, but just look at nearly all ongoing projects: the delays with the LCA "Tejas" (hopefully now on track), these countless upgrade projects (Jaguar, MiG-29, Mirage 2000, ...), the contract issues with the Rafale, the problems related to the FGFA, manufacturing issues for the BAe hawks, the own HJT-36 "Sitara", the own transport, AEW ... the list is nearly as long as the US or Russia's current "to do" list.
I don't want to say they should wait or scale down their ambitions, but I have that strange strong feeling in my stomach that the Indian system of bureaucracy, the management at HAL, political and military interventions and to admit also the technical base cannot handle so many projects at the same time.

And this is the problem where they should do their homework first ... not again setting more and more projects on the list to do.

Just my 2 Cents,
Deino

A Bar Brother · Feb 8, 2015

Deino said:
o.k. that is new to me Thanks a lot !

But ... and I know several Indian Aviation enthusiasts don't want to hear that or they won't like me for that: it is again too much, too soon with too less fixed concepts ...

I can understand that they have all these latest gems on their wish-list, but just look at nearly all ongoing projects: the delays with the LCA "Tejas" (hopefully now on track), these countless upgrade projects (Jaguar, MiG-29, Mirage 2000, ...), the contract issues with the Rafale, the problems related to the FGFA, manufacturing issues for the BAe hawks, the own HJT-36 "Sitara", the own transport, AEW ... the list is nearly as long as the US or Russia's current "to do" list.
I don't want to say they should wait or scale down their ambitions, but I have that strange strong feeling in my stomach that the Indian system of bureaucracy, the management at HAL, political and military interventions and to admit also the technical base cannot handle so many projects at the same time.

And this is the problem where they should do their homework first ... not again setting more and more projects on the list to do.

Just my 2 Cents,
Deino

Yeah. DRDO needs more scientists. The govt is working on it. I believe there is a drive to recruit 500 new scientists this year.

A Bar Brother · Feb 8, 2015

Deino said:
But ... and I know several Indian Aviation enthusiasts don't want to hear that or they won't like me for that: it is again too much, too soon with too less fixed concepts ...

Who cares about what the other person thinks. There are only two options on the internet, say what other people like or say the truth. I prefer the latter.

If something fails, it fails, nationalism be damned. Some people can never grasp this reality.

You don't have to worry about offending me. I like to hear the "real" opinions of people.

Quon_Duixote · Feb 8, 2015

Deino said:
o.k. that is new to me Thanks a lot !

But ... and I know several Indian Aviation enthusiasts don't want to hear that or they won't like me for that: it is again too much, too soon with too less fixed concepts ...

I can understand that they have all these latest gems on their wish-list, but just look at nearly all ongoing projects: the delays with the LCA "Tejas" (hopefully now on track), these countless upgrade projects (Jaguar, MiG-29, Mirage 2000, ...), the contract issues with the Rafale, the problems related to the FGFA, manufacturing issues for the BAe hawks, the own HJT-36 "Sitara", the own transport, AEW ... the list is nearly as long as the US or Russia's current "to do" list.
I don't want to say they should wait or scale down their ambitions, but I have that strange strong feeling in my stomach that the Indian system of bureaucracy, the management at HAL, political and military interventions and to admit also the technical base cannot handle so many projects at the same time.

And this is the problem where they should do their homework first ... not again setting more and more projects on the list to do.

Just my 2 Cents,
Deino

Yeah but dont forget that much of the news that percolates to the media regarding these programmes are filtered through the eyes of security experts who dont want to leak too much while maintaining momentum in terms of communication. AMCA hopefully will feed off of the LCA programme and use some of the lessons learnt but have a much faster product lifecyle .

aksha · Feb 8, 2015

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India imports all spl coatings for mil aircraft. DRDO says it's developed new, better stuff. (Sigh, ignore the F-15).

Indian Military News, Reports, Data, etc.

Deino

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aksha

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A Bar Brother

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aksha

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A Bar Brother

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Deino

Lieutenant General

A Bar Brother

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A Bar Brother

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Quon_Duixote

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aksha

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