Future PLA combat aircraft composition

lcloo

Captain
I would like to think that the total number of J20s to be produced over its production period of, say 20 years, would depend on the need of PLAAF to counter potential threats rather than base on production capacity. Production capacity should be dependent on the total number of aircraft needed, and shall be expanded if the manufacturer think that current capacity cannot meet the demand.

Example, assumed PLAAF planners think that 800 J20s are needed in next 20 years period from 2017 ( year of introduction), i.e. 2017 to 2037, then the simple average production rate would be 40 units per year. However, during the first few years and the last few years of production period, the annual rates would be anywhere from 4 aircraft per year to 40 per year. Therefore in between the initial and ending production periods, the normal annual rate would be higher than 40, so it could be from 40 to 60 per year.

We cannot confirm if the rumoured 4 production lines expansion for J20 is true, but we can be assured there could be multiple production lines if the demand called for more aircraft numbers beyond capacity of one or two production lines. This of course would require building more production floor area.

The same supply and demand situation applies for engine annual out put as well.

As to how many J20s are needed in total, we can only speculate, based on the possible total number of F-22 and F-35 in foreign bases around China from present to foreseeable future, or during a time of war.
 
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Atomicfrog

Major
Registered Member
As to how many J20s are needed in total, we can only speculate, based on the possible total number of F-22 and F-35 in foreign bases around China from present to foreseeable future, or during a time of war.
Total numbers will always be an estimate. Putting all your tokens in one fighter is good logistically but could also bring problems ifthey got maintenance issue. The ''j-31/j-35'' project could replace a good part of the number needed in the J-20 niche. F-22 will be retired well before the J-20 and 6th generation fighter will start to bloom in 10years or so.
 

tamsen_ikard

Junior Member
Registered Member
How big is the PLA Air power in terms of number of modern fighters in 2022. The last time I saw a count was in 2019 and then it was 1150 something in terms of 4th gen fighters (J-10, flankers, J-20).

How many modern 4th gen is the PLA producing per year to at least Catch up to US numbers which is (2600+) at the moment. Although it is important to build more 5th gen fighters but China is really behind in terms of even 4th gen numbers at the moment. They still have about 400+ older planes like J-7,J-8.

I think the only bottleneck left in the PLA is Air Power. Everything else China has mostly caught up whether its ship building, army mechanization, missile force, satellites and so on.


@Deino @Bltizo
 

Atomicfrog

Major
Registered Member
How big is the PLA Air power in terms of number of modern fighters in 2022. The last time I saw a count was in 2019 and then it was 1150 something in terms of 4th gen fighters (J-10, flankers, J-20).

How many modern 4th gen is the PLA producing per year to at least Catch up to US numbers which is (2600+) at the moment. Although it is important to build more 5th gen fighters but China is really behind in terms of even 4th gen numbers at the moment. They still have about 400+ older planes like J-7,J-8.

I think the only bottleneck left in the PLA is Air Power. Everything else China has mostly caught up whether its ship building, army mechanization, missile force, satellites and so on.


@Deino @Bltizo
Air power number and air power availability are two differents things. For China, a lot of their 4th generation (J-10, J-16, J-11B) are quite new and most of them are probably in good shape. We see big numbers on paper on the US side but a lot are quite aged and the lacks of parts are well known. For example, the US Navy had less than 50% of their planes able to fly in 2017...

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Having half the aircrafts but in good conditions is better than twice the number with half not able to fly... you are burried with maintenances, costly repair of old components and planes taking hangar places. So just comparing number is a bit of a fanclub thinking.
 

tamsen_ikard

Junior Member
Registered Member
Air power and air power availability is two differents things. For China, a lot of 4th generation (J-10, J-16, J-11B) are quite new and most of them are probably in good shape. We see big numbers on the US side but a lot are quite aged and the lacks of parts are well known. For example, the US Navy had less than 50% of their planes able to fly in 2017...

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Having half the aircrafts but in good conditions is better than twice the number with half not able to fly... you are burried with maintenances, and planes taking hangar places. So just comparing number is a bit of a fanclub thinking.


I am sure by the time US and China tensions reach high enough levels that War seems imminent, US will vastly increase its budget to not only produce spare parts for those aging fighters, but it could also bring vast number of decommissioned F-16, F-15 out of the bone yards. That's another reserve of fighters that US has that China doesn't have.

War between US and China will be a war of productions, budgets, state capacities, political resilience. US has a huge reserve of former fighter pilots, civil pilots and 4th gen planes that are in storage. China will need to massively out produce US for many years to catch up to those numbers
 

Maikeru

Major
Registered Member
I am sure by the time US and China tensions reach high enough levels that War seems imminent, US will vastly increase its budget to not only produce spare parts for those aging fighters, but it could also bring vast number of decommissioned F-16, F-15 out of the bone yards. That's another reserve of fighters that US has that China doesn't have.

War between US and China will be a war of productions, budgets, state capacities, political resilience. US has a huge reserve of former fighter pilots, civil pilots and 4th gen planes that are in storage. China will need to massively out produce US for many years to catch up to those numbers
The obvious shortcut for China would be UCAVs which don't require a pilot.
 

tamsen_ikard

Junior Member
Registered Member
The obvious shortcut for China would be UCAVs which don't require a pilot.
UCAVs can be easily jammed with Electronic warfare if they are still piloted from the ground. Drones are more useful for ground bombing than air to air fights
 

AndrewS

Brigadier
Registered Member
I am sure by the time US and China tensions reach high enough levels that War seems imminent, US will vastly increase its budget to not only produce spare parts for those aging fighters, but it could also bring vast number of decommissioned F-16, F-15 out of the bone yards. That's another reserve of fighters that US has that China doesn't have.

War between US and China will be a war of productions, budgets, state capacities, political resilience. US has a huge reserve former fighter pilots, civil pilots and 4th gen planes that are in storage. China will need to massively out produce US for many years to catch up to those numbers

If we ever do reach those levels of tensions, I'd expect Chinese military spending to accelerate significantly.

If China wanted to double military spending tomorrow, a lot of that would go to waste and inflation because it takes time for the supply chain to ramp up. Call it 2-3 years to increase equipment procurement rates for existing aircraft types.

That would rapidly make existing 4th Gen aircraft obsolete.

And that would still only leave Chinese military spending at 3-3.5% of GDP
 

reservior dogs

Junior Member
Registered Member
I am sure by the time US and China tensions reach high enough levels that War seems imminent, US will vastly increase its budget to not only produce spare parts for those aging fighters, but it could also bring vast number of decommissioned F-16, F-15 out of the bone yards. That's another reserve of fighters that US has that China doesn't have.

War between US and China will be a war of productions, budgets, state capacities, political resilience. US has a huge reserve of former fighter pilots, civil pilots and 4th gen planes that are in storage. China will need to massively out produce US for many years to catch up to those numbers
This should not be a problem for the following reasons,

1. U.S. is a global power with stakes all over the entire globe, while China today and even a decade from now will still be a regional military power. The U.S. can only dedicate a portion of its military in East Asia.

2. A war between the U.S. and China, for the next decade at least, will be fought in the backyard of China. China will not wage a military campaign in Africa, Europe or Latin America. There won't be any hot war with China itself, but maybe a proxy war with one of China's neighbors. Air power won't matter in this case.

3. While today, the U.S. fighters can reach China from South Korea or Japan, in a hot war with China, South Korea can be militarily occupied and Japan can be bombed. Most of Japan's industries are located in a small strip of land. a concerted bombing can send Japan back to the stone ages.
 
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