F-35 Joint Strike Fighter News, Videos and pics Thread

[adeptitus]

re: F-35 Joint Strike Fighter Thread

The F-35 is pretty expensive, but the Eurofighter might actually cost more per aircraft in export to Japan. The Saudis paid what, 112.5 million Euros each? Depending on the Euro exchange rate and increased price for latest Tranche 3 models, it wouldn't surprise me if the unit price goes over $150 million USD.

I think whenever carrier fans see a flat top, their eyes glaze over with stars and they start fantasizing about the ship becoming a fixed-wing aircraft carrier? The Japanese 22DDH specs is 19,000-19,500 tons empty, yet I see carrier fans push the "full load' specs toward 30,000 tons?

The 22DDH is not built to operate fixed wing fighters. I've said this before and I'll say it again, if and when the Japanese want an aircraft carrier, they will build a real aircraft carrier (or 2).

If you look at the wiki page for the Korean Dokdo class, someone actually put in a blurb about the South Koreans looking to purchase ex-RAF Harriers to operate from the Dokdo and possibly form a joint US-SK-JP Harrier squad based in Okinawa. It's one thing for armchair admirals having fun and indulging themselves, but this kind of stuff is clearly unsuitable as reference material.

 

[advill]

re: F-35 Joint Strike Fighter Thread

The US Military, the Japanese and others who opted for the F-35 would have made serious assessments of the aircraft. Other comments are inconsequential as the "die" has been cast.

 

[Jeff Head]

re: F-35 Joint Strike Fighter Thread

The 22DDH is not built to operate fixed wing fighters. I've said this before and I'll say it again, if and when the Japanese want an aircraft carrier, they will build a real aircraft carrier (or 2).

Right now, politically, the JMSDF could not build one or two "real" carriers.

But they are increasingly building larger and larger helicopter destroyers (as they call them) and the 22DDH is certainbly STOVL capable. As to the 22DDH not being designed for fixed wing aircraft, well, they will say they do not intend to put and STOVL aircraft, but the fact that they moved the rear elevator to the side, the fact that they have removed the CIWS from the forward deck, the size, the hangar spaces, all indicate that the vessel is designed for and capable of carrying aircraft like the F-35B.

I believe they will. Time will tell, but I would not be surprised to see the Japanese purchase 24 or so F-35Bs after the first 22DDH is complete and in or finnished with trials, and after the US has worked out most if not all issues associated with the F-35B.

I will not "eat my hat", but I believe it will happen none the less.

I believe the Australians will ultimately have F-35Bs too. Korea? Possible for their Dokdos to go F-35Bs in the future too...but I highly doubt that they will comprise a wing of Harriers for them.

 

[Joshluot-34-85]

re: F-35 Joint Strike Fighter Thread

The F-35's internal weapons bay can carry four missiles or bombs. If it carries the AIM-9X outside under the wings, it lose its stealth capability. So in a fight with the Chengdu J-20???

 

[TerraN_EmpirE]

re: F-35 Joint Strike Fighter Thread

Although there is said too be some work under way too up the air too air internal carry too 6. but yes external stores make it less stealthy that part of the reason I always find the Argument that F35 carried more armament then F22 funny. Sure more external stores but too do so she becomes a flying billboard of a radar signature unless they finally deploy stealthy external stores.

 

[Joshluot-34-85]

re: F-35 Joint Strike Fighter Thread

Are there any stealthy external storages in service with the U.S. military?

 

[Schumacher]

re: F-35 Joint Strike Fighter Thread

Why exactly would EF-2000 be a better choice, according to the fanboys?

The usual stuffs like what paintgun and F35 critics say. But a major motivation many Japan fanboys root for EF2000 is the hope it'll somehow show that major Japan foreign/defense policies are made in Tokyo, not Washington.

 

[Scratch]

re: F-35 Joint Strike Fighter Thread

Are there any stealthy external storages in service with the U.S. military?

I think there have been tests and studies with one for the Raptor back in the day. I don't know if anything came out of it though. Boeing is also proposing that concept in their Blk III SuperHornet concept.

I guess such a pod would actually really make sense, even for legacy fighters. They can have a nicely cleaned up exterior and some RCS reduction meassures applied nowadays, but carrying weapons will always breake that up again.
Having one streamlined contrainer around all the weapons hanging from the stores might also actually relief some drag.
Anyhow, I know of no operational system, just ideas and concepts.

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[TerraN_EmpirE]

re: F-35 Joint Strike Fighter Thread

If they did have them I doubt we would be made aware of it early on but there are no indications of it just yet. Lockmart has stated they were on it for both lighting ( who needs it ) and Raptor ( for whom it would be nice ) at the moment the closest I can think of would be the Conformal fuel/ weapon system seen on the mockup of the F15SE

 

[Scratch]

re: F-35 Joint Strike Fighter Thread

A little bit of background info on the japanese F-35 buy by aviationweek.
- F-35A won on a performance basis
- is the cheapeast because the other two need modification for boom refuling
- Japan to produce 40% of the parts (wings & tail, maybe final assembly)
- After initial 42 may buy more because industry capacity already in place

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Japan Judged F-35 To Have Best Performance
Dec 22, 2011 - By Bradley Perrett

BEIJING — The Japanese defense ministry says the Lockheed Martin F-35A Lightning’s performance beat that of the other two contenders in the competition for Japan’s F-X fighter requirement.

The ministry says the F-35A also was the cheapest, because the competing Eurofighter Typhoon and Boeing F/A-18E/F Super Hornet would have needed modification for flying-boom inflight refueling.

Japanese industry will be able to make 40% of the aircraft’s “300 components,” according to a Sankei newspaper report that does not say how the parts have been counted. The Yomiuri newspaper says the U.S. government is proposing that Japan build F-35 wings and tails, work that would otherwise go to Lockheed Martin and BAE Systems, respectively.

These reports indicate that Japan will, as expected, retreat from its previous policy of near-complete manufacturing of fighters. But it will retain considerable industrial capabilities, at least in structures. Lockheed Martin is also suggesting that Japan build a final assembly plant, which it is likely to do.

The larger the local industrial involvement in building Japanese F-35s, the greater the likelihood that the country will keep building them after the initial requirement for 42 is filled. Although recent news reports say Japan needs 40-50 F-35s, the defense ministry confirms it will buy 42, the number that industry executives had been expecting. Before the F-X selection was made, Japanese manufacturers urged that the aircraft be built in-country until the late 2020s to replace some of its Boeing F-15Js.

The defense ministry says it gave each contender a score in four areas. A maximum of 50 points was available for aircraft performance, 22.5 for cost, 22.5 for domestic industrial participation and 5 for after-sales support.

It does not explain why the F-35 led in the assessment of performance, except that the result was based on operations research, but the defense ministry adds that it was also judged as having the best after-sales support. The stealth fighter appears to have lagged on domestic industrial participation — because the U.S. government is not expected to allow enough technology transfer to build all of it. Eurofighter agreed to 95% “information-sharing” and Boeing to 70-80%, the Sankei says, without explanation. The information-sharing offer for the F-35 was extremely low by comparison, the paper says.

Eurofighter officials had previously said Japan could build as much of the Typhoon as they wanted. Eurofighter’s offer particularly appealed to some members of the Diet, according to a newspaper from the Nagoya area, where Mitsubishi Heavy Industries has its aerospace works. Several of them argued in a meeting of the Diet defense committee that Japan should choose the Typhoon for the F-X requirement, to replace F-4EJ Kai Phantoms, and then switch to the F-35.

The defense ministry makes no mention of assigning a value to the risk of buying each aircraft, as its counterparts in other countries often do, especially when considering an order for equipment that is still under development. After repeated delays, the F-35 is now due to achieve initial operational capability with the U.S. Air Force in 2018, with its F-35A version.

The first four F-35As for Japan are to be ordered in the fiscal year that begins on April 1, 2012, for delivery in 2016. The defense ministry expects them to cost ¥9.9 billion ($127 million) each, not including the cost of running them. That leaves a lot of room for savings when compared with the ¥15 billion unit cost that Defense Minister Yasuo Ichikawa cited in November for further production of the Mitsubishi Heavy Industries F-2 strike fighter.

The defense ministry projects that Japan will spend ¥1.6 trillion in buying all 42 F-35As and operating them for 20 years.