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Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
I see the last paragraph is:

Four! :)

It is a mistake to buy aircraft that are simply too expensive.
Delft, the number "four" does not represent the Netherlands total buy. That is just for the intial purchase.

The Netherlands plans to buy and activate over 30 F-35s...35-37 I believe. That number of aircraft, the maintenance, the training, etc. is what they are spending 5.8 billion on. Clearly not 5.8 billion for four aircraft.

And doing so for that number of aircraft and all that comes with them will not be a mistake.

If the people of the Netherlands really think it is...they can elect new representatives and cancel everything. But I do not see that happening in the least.
 
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TerraN_EmpirE

Tyrant King
NATO trio could pool A330 tanker fleet
By: CRAIG HOYLELONDON Source: Flightglobal.com in 3 hours
A consortium of NATO nations could acquire a four-strong fleet of Airbus A330 multi-role tanker/transports (MRTT), the European Defence Agency (EDA) has announced.

Announcing the development on 19 December, the multinational agency said: “The Netherlands, Poland and Norway have decided to prepare negotiations with Airbus Defence & Space for a fleet of A330 MRTT multirole transport and air-to-air refuelling aircraft.”

The decision comes after an analysis determined that “only one military off-the-shelf solution met their key requirements in terms of capabilities and timeframe,” the EDA says. A configuration with under-wing hose and drogue refuelling pods and a refuelling boom has been chosen, and the MRTT also would “meet the user’s requirements in terms of passenger transport, strategic airlift, and medical evacuation”.

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Airbus Defence & Space

Expected to achieve initial operational capability during 2019, the pooling initiative will also be opened to enable additional nations to participate, “through joining the acquisition and/or in-service phase,” the EDA says.

The Dutch defence ministry says it hopes to see a contract finalised in 2016, with the new aircraft to be operational from 2020, when its air force’s current two McDonnell Douglas KDC-10 tankers. NATO could potentially house and maintain the future fleet at its Eindhoven air base, it adds.

However, it adds: “This engagement in further negotiations does not constitute a commitment by the EDA, NATO Support Agency, OCCAR [procurement agency] or the participating nations to place an order.”

Of the three programme partners, only the Netherlands has a current tanker capability. Poland has also been pursuing a possible national-only acquisition of two aircraft, with Airbus offering the A330 and an Israel Aerospace Industries-led team a modified fleet of Boeing 767-200ERs.

Only one NATO air force currently operates the A330 MRTT, with the UK Royal Air Force using an eight-strong fleet supplied via the AirTanker consortium. France has also confirmed its intention to buy 12 of the type, for delivery from 2018.

The tanker/transport is also today used by the air forces of Australia, Saudi Arabia and the United Arab Emirates, with an order also in place from Singapore, and pending deals to be finalised with India and Qatar.
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More pooling
 

asif iqbal

Lieutenant General
I have said this many times before that A-400 should not be limited to just cargo role

What is European Air Force biggest weakness in the air? It's the limited nunbers of tankers they have and repeatedly USAF in Europe always bails them out

Now that's fair enough but Europe can't carry out a single mission fully independently without American help, one would then say well why would they? But then I would say well because you can't really rely on someone else for ever can you?

Europe needs to add lots of these A-400 equipped tankers to cover all the shortage in tanker needs, the recent Mali campaign by France required USAF to do the heavy lifting

A-400 is a good project and they should make most of it
 

FORBIN

Lieutenant General
Registered Member
With the generated turbulence caused by this powerful engines can't refuel EC-725 definitely others helos also.
 

TerraN_EmpirE

Tyrant King
Bye Bye Boeing? :confused:
Boeing is not going anywhere. Italy, Israel, Japan, The Us and a few others operate Boeing built tankers. boeing still hs the lead in AEW as no on has bought C-295 AEW.

With the generated turbulence caused by this powerful engines can't refuel EC-725 definitely others helos also.
Agreed Fortunately there the A330 MTT can and there is still KC130J configuration already in Italy. If the Europeans wished as they bring A400M's on line they could retrofit there C130J's operated by Denmark, Italy and the Uk as well as convert and life extension older C130's in France and a few selected C160's in both France and Germany.
 

Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
Bye Bye Boeing? :confused:
What? Over a fleet of, what...four?

Makes for a nice laugh though...hehehe!.

I believe these A330 or going to be very good aircraft, and I am sure there will b more ordered...but they are a long, long, long, long ways from challenging Boeing in terms of numbers. Now or in the future.

Right now, Boeing has the following::

KC-135 - Stratotanker, 440 still in use by Chile (3), Singapore (4), France (11), Turkey (7) and the United States (415)
KC-767 - 11 Aircraft (Italy, Japan, Columbia, and two on order from Brazil)
KC-46 - Pegasus (Based on 767) - 1 (Won the USAF program. 19 to be delivered by 2016, another 160 by 2027)

There will probably be a lot more of the KC-46s ordered.
 

navyreco

Senior Member
Gotta admit however A330 MRTT won most if not all the recent tenders when it was pitched against the KC767.
(Even the USAF was initially gonna go for it)

That may be due to the fact that some consider the A330 to be in a different category than the 767 (the original platform itself is slightly larger, flies slightly further out... A330 is slightly newer than 767)

It would be up to Boeing to offer a tanker based on 777 but I am pretty sure that currently they have their hands full with the KC-46.

Maybe a KC"777" will come out for KC-Y and KC-Z (future USAF requirements to replace the fleet of KC-10 and what not).
 

FORBIN

Lieutenant General
Registered Member
14 for France :) 11 C-135 which are better for transport and can receive medical kit/system "Morphée" main modification electric power and 3 KC-135 former USAF less polyvalent but very old max in general 7 operationnal.

Before 10 years our have need help a A-310 German transports wounded, in Germany law requires German AF get this capability.
 
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