European Military News, Reports, Data, etc.

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gelgoog

Lieutenant General
Registered Member
The French have done joint military development projects successfully. One example is the SEPECAT Jaguar. There are also more modern examples like the Tiger helicopter or the A400M.

You could argue that some of the features the French insisted on having for the Rafale made it a more suitable aircraft overall than the Eurofighter.
 
Maikeru

Maikeru

Major
Registered Member
gelgoog said:
The French have done joint military development projects successfully. One example is the SEPECAT Jaguar. There are also more modern examples like the Tiger helicopter or the A400M.

You could argue that some of the features the French insisted on having for the Rafale made it a more suitable aircraft overall than the Eurofighter.
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Yeah, that was decades ago and Dassault competed vigorously with the Jaguar, pitching Mirage F1 against it in every export battle. See also "Lynx".
 
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Abominable

Major
Registered Member
gelgoog said:
The French have done joint military development projects successfully. One example is the SEPECAT Jaguar. There are also more modern examples like the Tiger helicopter or the A400M.

You could argue that some of the features the French insisted on having for the Rafale made it a more suitable aircraft overall than the Eurofighter.
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The point isn't the quality of the end product, it's what you can do with it. Say France decides to go on a big expedition into Africa, but partner countries strongly oppose and refuse to provide engines. Or say the Germans elect another Nazi government in the next few years. Even now Europeans can't seem to agree on anything when it comes to foreign policy, why would you bank your nations defence on that very faulty premise?

All these European joint projects are done for political reasons, to bolster the EU superstate project and all are short sighted with no contingency plan.

I understand some countries have no choice but to depend on other countries for military equipment, but when you are a country with the military industry background of France or the UK there is no excuse.
 
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Soldier30

Senior Member
Registered Member
A Norwegian F-35 landed on a Finnish highway for the first time. On Thursday, September 21st, an important event took place in the history of Norwegian aviation. For the first time, two Norwegian F-35As landed on a highway in Tervo in eastern Finland. The planes landed at around 15:00 Norwegian time after participating in joint exercise Baana 23 with Finnish F-18s. American F-35Bs have landed on highways in the past, but this is the first time the F-35A has done so. Combat aircraft are vulnerable on the ground, so by being able to use small airfields and now highways, we are increasing our survivability in war,” Major General Rolf Volland, commander of the Norwegian Air Force, said in a press release. After the planes landed, they were refueled with the engines running. In March, Norway, Sweden, Finland and Denmark signed an agreement on a joint Nordic Air Force. The future Nordic air defense will consist of more than 200 combat aircraft.

 
Broccoli

Broccoli

Senior Member
Multiple news outlets report that the United States and Finland are nearing a deal to sign a Defence Co-operation Agreement to broaden and deepen military cooperation between the two countries.

Both Yle and
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reported that the contract could be ready for signing at the civil servant level as early as this week. It would then pass to the government and president for approval at the political level.

HS writes that its sources say the deal would give America greater flexibility in using Finnish territory than in neighbouring Norway, for instance.

It would also allow the US military to use Congress-mandated funds for the construction of military infrastructure in Finland, and allow US soldiers to arrive at shorter notice for training and exercises in Finland.
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RC-135V/W "Jake 11" has been making regular flights near Russian border ever since Finland joined NATO and I suspect we also see land-based SIGINT deployments very near russian border in not too distant future.
 
sunnymaxi

sunnymaxi

Major
Registered Member

Germany may abandon €100bn fighter jet project with France​


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Germany is considering abandoning its flagship €100 billion future combat jet project with France and joining a rival programme with Britain instead, The Times has been told..

setback for France. Germany is the major contributor financially in this project. France has no choice but to go alone..
 
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gelgoog

Lieutenant General
Registered Member
"Paris has, for example, snubbed Scholz’s “Sky Shield” initiative to bundle together European countries’ air and missile defence procurement, because it regards Germany’s preference for “off the shelf” systems from countries such as the US and Israel as an affront to its own research and development in this domain."
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It wouldn't be that hard to make a land based version of Aster or CAMM instead of buying the Patriot from the US. In fact these already exist: the SAMP/T and Sky Sabre. Instead the Germans shovel money to Uncle Sam.

“When France says European defence policy, it means French industrial interests,” a senior source in Germany’s ruling coalition said. “Scholz feels he has far more in common with the British than with the French on these issues.”
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What would German industry contribute to this FCAS project anyway? The German defense industry has atrophied to a remarkable degree and in some cases like electronics it is weak as hell. Weaker in military electronics than even the Italians.

In the case of Eurofighter the Germans used the fact they were going to make a large purchase to demand that a lot of systems be developed in Germany. They demanded more workshare commensurate with their order share. This then significantly delayed the project and increased costs because of their sheer lack of experience and capability. To add insult to injury they then cutback their orders significantly when it came time for production, ordering less in percentage terms than their work share.

It will be faster and cheaper for the French to do the project themselves. Plus now that Rafale has proven itself to be an export success the business case for going alone with FCAS will be more solid.
 
TK3600

TK3600

Major
Registered Member
gelgoog said:
It wouldn't be that hard to make a land based version of Aster or CAMM instead of buying the Patriot from the US. In fact these already exist: the SAMP/T and Sky Sabre. Instead the Germans shovel money to Uncle Sam.


What would German industry contribute to this FCAS project anyway? The German defense industry has atrophied to a remarkable degree and in some cases like electronics it is weak as hell. Weaker in military electronics than even the Italians.

In the case of Eurofighter the Germans used the fact they were going to make a large purchase to demand that a lot of systems be developed in Germany. They demanded more workshare commensurate with their order share. This then significantly delayed the project and increased costs because of their sheer lack of experience and capability. To add insult to injury they then cutback their orders significantly when it came time for production, ordering less in percentage terms than their work share.

It will be faster and cheaper for the French to do the project themselves. Plus now that Rafale has proven itself to be an export success the business case for going alone with FCAS will be more solid.
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Germans being on the same team is already an undeserved honor. Countries like Turkey is far superior.
 
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