CV-18 Fujian/003 CATOBAR carrier thread

Totoro

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I'd just like to point out that these alleged 003 dimensions don't necessarily have to mesh with reality. This twitter post claims 44.5 m wide stern section without sponsons. Yet when measured in Google Earth, the width of that section is some 40 m.

If indeed the GE measuring tool is more precise, then all those discrepancies will add up and the final dimensions may then be visibly different from what the rest of that twitter post suggests.
 

Blitzo

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I'd just like to point out that these alleged 003 dimensions don't necessarily have to mesh with reality. This twitter post claims 44.5 m wide stern section without sponsons. Yet when measured in Google Earth, the width of that section is some 40 m.

If indeed the GE measuring tool is more precise, then all those discrepancies will add up and the final dimensions may then be visibly different from what the rest of that twitter post suggests.

That is one question I was wondering about with regards to the 44.5m wide stern -- where they got it from.

That said, I'm not sure about your claim either -- the 40m measurement for the stern on GE as far as I can see (if we're talking about the most recent imagery of 003 available, which is October 2020 last year) -- was taken when the height of the stern (and indeed the entire hull of the ship) was only at the level of the hangar deck floor, whereas the 44.5m measure is multiple decks higher, and even in that stern picture, we can see how the hull flares upwards somewhat from where the floor of the hangar deck would be.


Based on this earlier picture (admittedly at a slightly earlier stage of assembly than the stern photo used, but still enough to gauge the same visual flight deck level width that horobeyo measured), we can get a rough ratio of the internal width of the drydock with the width of the flight deck level width (red and green lines respectively).

Now, apparently there are tender documents from the drydock's initial construction saying it is 82m in internal width (which corresponds to the 81-82m width that I get on GE).

From there, the ratio of 307/349 x 82m, I get 72.1m for the flight deck level width.
Now, obviously there are some errors involved in my measurements (red and green lines aren't perfectly parallel, the image is indeed blurry), but I think the ballpark measurement of some 72m for the width of the flight deck is reasonable.

Obviously one source of error that might be there is the measurement of the internal width of the drydock (red line) in the image, specifically on the left side of the line... but looking at images of the drydock from satellite and taken from other perspectives in the shipyard, I think my measurement is accurate because we can see the tracks for the gantry crane is some 5.6m out from the wall of the drydock that can be measured on GE, and on the picture is some 24 pixels long (yellow line).


So, at this stage I'm tempted to say a flight deck width of some 72ish meters as measured is definitely within reason. Obviously we'd need better pictures to measure in time, ideally good quality satellite pics.... but as it stands I think the estimate is decent.

Of course feel free to provide a counter estimate.



compare.jpg
 

Totoro

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Well, I am measuring just the stern section without the overhangs. When taking into account the level of completion of the GE image (october 2020) and assuming that's more or less hangar level deck height, then i get more than 40 m. More precisely, I get 41.7 m width. (still less than 44.5 m suggested by that twitter post)

I do believe/hope the next GE update (or a good satellite image from other sources with enough context for scaling the ship up) will put a lot of these measurement discussions to rest.
 

Blitzo

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Well, I am measuring just the stern section without the overhangs. When taking into account the level of completion of the GE image (october 2020) and assuming that's more or less hangar level deck height, then i get more than 40 m. More precisely, I get 41.7 m width. (still less than 44.5 m suggested by that twitter post)

I do believe/hope the next GE update (or a good satellite image from other sources with enough context for scaling the ship up) will put a lot of these measurement discussions to rest.

The problem is the image you're using only measures the width of the stern at the level of the hangar deck, whereas the 44.5m is being taken at the level of the flight deck, multiple decks higher, and with a visible flaring of the hull as well.
The October 2020 GE image tells us nothing about what the satellite measured width of the stern at the flight deck level will be given it wasn't even installed at that time

However, we can measure roughly the stern width in that same image
Again, imperfect, but 187 pixels would be some 43.9m, and compensating for error, I think a stern width at flight deck level of about 44m is reasonable?



I agree that fussing over a few meters at this stage is not that important and we'll get the truth eventually, but as far as methodology goes, I think using the October GE image is incorrect because it is some 4-5 decks levels lower (and thus correspondingly narrower) than what the 44.5m measures.

compare 2.jpg
 
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Totoro

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You get 43.9 m, i get 41.7 m, as per my previous post. Evidently all these measurements are a bit pointless, when so much error is involved by two people using the very same image.
 

Blitzo

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You get 43.9 m, i get 41.7 m, as per my previous post. Evidently all these measurements are a bit pointless, when so much error is involved by two people using the very same image.

For the sake of methodology, can you illustrate what you're measuring to 41.7m?
I updated my previous post with an image depicting the 187 pixel measure (measured at the sternmost part of the flight deck level -- which I note, I believe is a few meters wider than the "unpainted central hull sans overhangs/sponsons" in the amidships part)
 

Intrepid

Major
What is the goal, why do you need to find out exact dimensions now? How does it change the determination of the aircraft carrier to be an intermediate step towards the nuclear-powered fleet aircraft carrier?
 

Totoro

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What is the goal, why do you need to find out exact dimensions now? How does it change the determination of the aircraft carrier to be an intermediate step towards the nuclear-powered fleet aircraft carrier?
Personally, it's just for fun. A meter here or there doesn't mean much. Especially with so much margin for error. Alternatively: while it's an intermediate step toward the next carrier, sizing 003 up to other carriers still gives some semblance of its potential capabilites. Of course the whole measurement tirade will be repeated with the next carrier class.
 

Intrepid

Major
Aircraft carriers with 100,000 tons of water displacement are small ships; ship steel is no longer expensive compared to planning, development and operation. Nowadays it is better to build something bigger and not be so crowded with airplanes.
 
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