COMAC C919

tphuang

tphuang

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https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1744352372833296881

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Expect significantly increased action from C919 with MU this year. Not only more routes but also longer block hours.

All expected obviously

and has taken longer time than usual to reach this point

But for a new aircraft, the kiddy glove approach is understandable.
 
tphuang

tphuang

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Atomicfrog said:
For sure but in the meantime, it's important to aggressively ramping up funding rate and put all the necessaries fondations to make that aircraft independent of foreign influences. That aircraft right now is the corner stone of China commercial aviation. Cost of CJ-1000 vs Leap 1C is not a concern if it deliver near the same performances. Just losing some money with it for Chinese government is way better than getting messed up with Boing/Airbus duopoly.
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it's not about losing money. The issue is just not having airplane in action. Chinese govt can subsidize airlines for using Leap-1C but if Leap-1C C919 is out of service for 2 months due to lack of servicing, then you have to cancel flights.
 
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Atomicfrog

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tphuang said:
it's not about losing money. The issue is just not having airplane in action. Chinese govt can subsidize airlines for using Leap-1C but if Leap-1C C919 is out of service for 2 months due to lack of servicing, then you have to cancel flights.
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It's why funding to be independent of foreign sources is needed to not getting messed up with Boing/Airbus duopoly. With that duopoly, Boeing don't even care anymore about quality these days... and US can play the game of sanctions on foreigns parts.
 
sunnymaxi

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tphuang said:
it's not about losing money. The issue is just not having airplane in action. Chinese govt can subsidize airlines for using Leap-1C but if Leap-1C C919 is out of service for 2 months due to lack of servicing, then you have to cancel flights.
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sir i don't understand what are you saying ..

how can LEAP-1C engine goes offline without lack of service. MTU with collaboration have two extensive repairing and maintenance facilities in mainland for all LEAP engines. they can service and repair upto 150 engines annually. second plant soon to be open.
 
tphuang

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sunnymaxi said:
sir i don't understand what are you saying ..

how can LEAP-1C engine goes offline without lack of service. MTU with collaboration have two extensive repairing and maintenance facilities in mainland for all LEAP engines. they can service and repair upto 150 engines annually. second plant soon to be open.
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oh, my brain fart as usual. I meant CJ1000A

Leap-1C should have no abnormal servicing issues.

CJ1000A is new and will take some time for service engineering to catch up
 
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tphuang said:
oh, my brain fart as usual. I meant CJ1000A

Leap-1C should have no abnormal servicing issues.

CJ1000A is new and will take some time for service engineering to catch up
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oh yeah.. CJ-1000A is totally a new machine. so once produce in significant numbers, AECC will open service/maintenance center in mainland. so cost of CJ-1000A will be higher than any other turbofan engine. a long and painful process .. but they have to do this..
 
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sunnymaxi said:
oh yeah.. CJ-1000A is totally a new machine. so once produce in significant numbers, AECC will open service/maintenance center in mainland. so cost of CJ-1000A will be higher than any other turbofan engine. a long and painful process .. but they have to do this..
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it will be interesting how they roll this out. Airlines and OEMs work in tandem. So if MU wants to put CJ1000A into usage, it might want to use it in a subsidiary where some cancellations are okay. For example, you don't as an airline want flights between SHA and PEK cancelled or disrupted. Similarly with SHA and CAN or SZX or TFU.

But there are routes which are just not as important. Which if you cancel and put pax on connection flight, not a big deal. I mean they will have time to figure this out, but it's a long process. No reason to rush it unless Leap-1C is cut off
 
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AndrewS

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tphuang said:
it's not about losing money. The issue is just not having airplane in action. Chinese govt can subsidize airlines for using Leap-1C [CJ1000A] but if Leap-1C C919 is out of service for 2 months due to lack of servicing, then you have to cancel flights.
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I don't think the airlines will be overtly subsidised for using the CJ1000A engine.

At the beginning, I expect every domestic Chinese airline will be "required" to have a certain percentage of their fleet using the CJ1000A engine.

So every airline in China is equally disadvantaged with somewhat higher costs, which is passed along as higher airfares to the public.

From the perspective of the Chinese government, that is a good thing as higher airfares would encourage more rail travel instead. From a global perspective, higher taxes on the carbon emissions produced during air travel are coming anyway, and overall would be a good thing for the world.

And eventually, we should expect Chinese airliner engines to be competitive globally and therefore not need any indirect subsidies.
 
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AndrewS said:
I don't think the airlines will be overtly subsidised for using the CJ1000A engine.

At the beginning, I expect every domestic Chinese airline will be "required" to have a certain percentage of their fleet using the CJ1000A engine.

So every airline in China is equally disadvantaged with somewhat higher costs, which is passed along as higher airfares to the public.

From the perspective of the Chinese government, that is a good thing as higher airfares would encourage more rail travel instead. From a global perspective, higher taxes on the carbon emissions produced during air travel are coming anyway, and overall would be a good thing for the world.

And eventually, we should expect Chinese airliner engines to be competitive globally and therefore not need any indirect subsidies.
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hmm, doesn't work that way. not every airline will have similar % of CJ1000A fleet.

If you don't subsidize, then you are just putting airlines with higher % of CJ1000A at disadvantage.

You want to incentive more CJ1000A hours in some manner. This won't be direct payment but rather through other incentivies
 
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gelgoog

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This is a chicken and egg problem. The CJ1000A won't get better lifetime until it is serially produced and they start fixing issues they discover in the field. Even though modern engines are tested quite a lot prior to entering service quite often issues are only discovered when there are quite a lot of them out there operating. Engines then are inspected, and more appropriate maintenance procedures, and sometimes redesigned or strengthened parts are put into service.

Just see all the issues that Pratt & Whitney and Rolls-Royce are having with their engines. Some people are refusing to buy the A220 with PW engines or 787s with RR engines because of that. GE isn't immune either. For example the GE 9X engine program is ridden with issues.
 
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