Chinese submarines thread

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BLUEJACKET

Banned Idiot
Re: Chinese sub thread

Additional Kilo imports from Russia seem implausible but perhaps China will be interested by a new and innovative AIP type Russia is developing. Initially a batch of 4 would be a first deal in order to keep russian shipyards busy and not selling to some people China very much dislikes. :D
They will be busy even without any new PRC orders:
Ind
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Mazepa

New Member
Re: Chinese sub thread

Just in from Swedish media (For those interested)

Swedish defence has assigned the company Kockums that constructed the competent Gotland Class AIP submarines to build a new generation of stealth-submarines with project number A26. One of its new features is that its undetectable for radar but i guess it will refine all the characteristics that make Gotland so successful. It will be nice to see what cutting edge technology can do instead of the 80´th technology that is the base for the Gotland Class..

Over and out from the land of Aurora Borealis..
 

tphuang

Lieutenant General
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Re: Chinese sub thread

newer pictures of yuan
yuandec2pr5.jpg

yuandec22tp9.jpg

looks like they are coming along nicely.
 

BLUEJACKET

Banned Idiot
Re: Chinese sub thread

I got a question: what impact their SSBN program has/will have on other domesticaly built submarine classes? In the Cold War, according to this
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, the USN tracked only about 20% of their SSBNs (their total # was certainly more than PLAN will ever have- unless they invest in them at the cost of attack subs). With fewer numbers, as I already observed , they'll loose their strategic value.

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The close encounter between a Chinese diesel sub and the American carrier USS Kitty Hawk on October 26 near Okinawa, first reported openly in the U.S. in mid-November, has already generated quite a lot of commentary. ..
China's seaward ambitions for deterrence -- both nuclear and conventional -- and for self-proclaimed regional hegemony need to be understood in the context of Beijing's own evolving, translucent (not opaque) strategic culture. The modern Song-class passive sonars are certainly good enough to know at a range of 10,000 yards that a group of big and noisy surface ships was there. No PLAN submarine captain in his right mind would surface in such conditions unless he wanted to be absolutely sure that his presence, previously undetected within the carrier's inner defense zone, was made unmistakably clear to theater U.S. admirals and their higher-ups inside the Beltway.
China is progressively drawing wider and wider deep-water redlines, warnings that her self-perceived inviolable defense interests lie thousands of miles beyond her coast, and American naval forces will in future cross those redlines at their perile.
A previous redline was signaled in 2003, when a Ming-class diesel sub transited on the surface between two of Japan's main islands in an east-to-west direction -- that is, on its way home from somewhere out in the blue Pacific. The Ming had not been previously detected despite its obsolescent design. Beijing was proving pointedly that the First Island Chain does not present an effective barrier to a surprise surge of Chinese submarines, a surge that could prove militarily decisive around 2030. On that timeframe, America's submarine fleet will have dwindled to barely 40, while China's is on a path to numbering 180 or even more by then.
 

Finn McCool

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Re: Chinese sub thread

On that timeframe, America's submarine fleet will have dwindled to barely 40, while China's is on a path to numbering 180 or even more by then.

Where are they getting that number from?! The LA class still has a long service life, and the US just introduced the Virgina Class. As for China's sub fleet, it is impossible to make any real projections (certainly not 180) about its future strength-the PLA is far too secretive.
 

joshuatree

Captain
Re: Chinese sub thread

Where are they getting that number from?! The LA class still has a long service life, and the US just introduced the Virgina Class. As for China's sub fleet, it is impossible to make any real projections (certainly not 180) about its future strength-the PLA is far too secretive.


What's the main difference between the Seawolf class and the Virginia class of US subs? I heard the Virginia class was to be a cheaper version by using off-the-shelf components BUT it has turned out to be just the same cost if not more. If so, are there any advantages with the Virginia class? Do both of these classes widen the gap between Chinese subs and American subs dramatically?
 

Kongo

Junior Member
Re: Chinese sub thread

The Virginia doesn't have as many torp tubes as the Seawolf. It also isn't as deep diving or as fast as the Seawolf. It still maintains the same tactical speed as the Seawolf, however, and is as quiet as the Seawolf at that speed. It also features improvements in certain areas in which is important for the littorals. For example, non-acoustic stealth is improved, and a fly-by-wire system automates an amazing amount of tasks and allows for very precise depth control. Both the Seawolf and the Virginias feature very dramatic improvements over even the 688Is. As an example, it was stated that the Seawolf was quieter at its tactical speed of 20+ knots than a 688I at pier. When compared with Chinese subs, 'dramatic' would be an understatement. Nothing to be surprised about actually. The Americans have always regarded their sub tech as one of their technological crown jewels.
 

Chengdu J-10

Junior Member
Re: Chinese sub thread

180 submarines in the PLAN??? Hope you aren't including the Ming and Romeo submarines in this number, because they are scheduled to be retired soon and replaced by the Yuan and Song class submarines. Also is 180 submarines really neccessary for the PLAN. This would mean that more docking facilities would needed to be constructed and maintainence and crew well that would take a lot of money out of the budget.
 

bd popeye

The Last Jedi
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Re: Chinese sub thread

Where are they getting that number from?! The LA class still has a long service life, and the US just introduced the Virgina Class. As for China's sub fleet, it is impossible to make any real projections (certainly not 180) about its future strength-the PLA is far too secretive.

Actually the USN intends to reduce it's subforce to a total of 48 by 2020. A number of LA class subs will be decomissioned. I am not filimar with how many subs the PLAN will have in the future.

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One reason to decomission a number of the LA class is that the remaining LA class will have a sonar ablity unparrelled with the addition of new Multi-Purpose Processor .

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"according to the US Navy, a single A-RCI Multi-Purpose Processor (MPP) has as much computing power as the entire legacy Los Angeles Class (SSN-688/688I) submarine fleet combined"
 
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Scratch

Captain
Re: Chinese sub thread

The processor may have the power of all other of the older ones combined, but will it have the detection range to cover the wider area due to the lesser vessels employed ?
And the PLAN is still distand from having 180 subs.
What would be the number of subs needed to cover lets say the western pacific and eastern indian ocean with constant sub operation while there are some in homeport and on overhaul ?
 
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