Chinese semiconductor industry

ansy1968 said:

Can the expert explain the significant of this breakthrough, If my memory serves me right most of the IP is hold by SK and Micron, so this effectively change the equation regarding DRAM and NAND?

from JSCh (Pakistan defense forum)

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Scientists at Beijing's Institute of Physics have made a nonvolatile memory that is 5000x faster than flash memory. It can also store multiple bits instead of just 0s and 1s.

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Atomically sharp interfaces in van der Waals heterostructures enable the realization of ultrafast non-volatile memory devices.

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1. Just my opinion that I am pulling straight outta mah arse ... this is a big time breakthrough that will change the industry and this superior product will wipe out the competition. Good!

2. The key term here is non-volatile memory, which means when the electricity is turned off, the state remains the same. Volatile memory means when you cut the power to the computer, all the data in the memory sticks are lost.

3. This part I had to look up, the an der Waals heterostructures, apparently is just stacking of two layers of materials on top one another, I assume it would be like two blankets. If you sleep naykid, not sure if we can picture that analogy.

4. This breakthrough goes into material science. What materials they used for the stacking of the blankets, so to speak, as long you ain't in the buff. Butt crack and everything. According to the encyclopedia, graphene could be a potential material.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Two-dimensional_semiconductor

5. So if you got two layers of atomic level type of spaces, because you got such advanced material science know-how, then they can make this greatly advanced memory stick, the thumb drive. If it is made of graphene, then it will sold at a China price.

6. For the record, I sleep with my clothes on, and usual one blanket, unless it is the winter.

@horse bro I remember your post about 5g application and how Huawei even though its smartphone business had taken a hit will remain strong! well she had provided more than 60% of China total base station or 45% of the world total. With that leadership she is able to diversify leveraging its expertise defeating the purposes of the ban which is to destroy her. Now we had to wait on its FAB progress, its the last crucial component to able to show the US the middle finger!!! JIA YOU

from CnTechPost

China has built 819,000 5G base stations, accounting for 70% world's total​

May 17, 2021
China has taken the lead in the development of , the next-generation communication technology, and has built a total of more than 819,000 5G base stations, accounting for about 70 percent of the world, China's Ministry of Industry and Information Technology (MIIT) recently said.
China has 280 million 5G cell phone end-user connections, accounting for more than 80 percent of the world's share, the MIIT said.
China's share of the world's 5G standard-essential patent declarations exceeds 38 percent, up nearly 5 percentage points since the first half of last year, ranking the first in the world.
Liu Honglie, Vice Minister of the MIIT, said China will continue to promote the rapid development of 5G, strengthening the development of international standards, and encouraging industry to participate in the standardization of 5G international specifications R17 and R18.
China will promote the development of 6G, carry out research on 6G application scenarios, and focus on promoting breakthroughs in key technology innovation, the MIIT said.

China will build on the foundation of 5G, combining technological evolution, economic and social development trends, and studying the future 6G vision needs and application scenarios, the MIIT said.

ansy1968 said:

@horse bro I remember your post about 5g application and how Huawei even though its smartphone business had taken a hit will remain strong! well she had provided more than 60% of China total base station or 45% of the world total. With that leadership she is able to diversify leveraging its expertise defeating the purposes of the ban which is to destroy her. Now we had to wait on its FAB progress, its the last crucial component to able to show the US the middle finger!!! JIA YOU

from CnTechPost

China has built 819,000 5G base stations, accounting for 70% world's total​

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May 17, 2021
China has taken the lead in the development of

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, the next-generation communication technology, and has built a total of more than 819,000 5G base stations, accounting for about 70 percent of the world, China's Ministry of Industry and Information Technology (MIIT) recently said.
China has 280 million 5G cell phone end-user connections, accounting for more than 80 percent of the world's share, the MIIT said.
China's share of the world's 5G standard-essential patent declarations exceeds 38 percent, up nearly 5 percentage points since the first half of last year, ranking the first in the world.
Liu Honglie, Vice Minister of the MIIT, said China will continue to promote the rapid development of 5G, strengthening the development of international standards, and encouraging industry to participate in the standardization of 5G international specifications R17 and R18.
China will promote the development of 6G, carry out research on 6G application scenarios, and focus on promoting breakthroughs in key technology innovation, the MIIT said.

China will build on the foundation of 5G, combining technological evolution, economic and social development trends, and studying the future 6G vision needs and application scenarios, the MIIT said.

Click to expand...

How often do you need to replace the chips inside these base stations?

Tyler said:

How often do you need to replace the chips inside these base stations?

Click to expand...

@Tyler sorry bro, a novice but from what I understand a 5g base station needs a 14nm chip and below to be fully efficient. Before the SMIC sanction, I think they had supply Huawei a large batch of 14nm chips, hope @WTAN and @foofy can back me up. And if the news of Huawei FAB 20nm chip production next year for their bases station, maybe they may tweak some parts to make it efficient comparable to the 14nm performance.

ansy1968 said:

@horse bro I remember your post about 5g application and how Huawei even though its smartphone business had taken a hit will remain strong! well she had provided more than 60% of China total base station or 45% of the world total. With that leadership she is able to diversify leveraging its expertise defeating the purposes of the ban which is to destroy her. Now we had to wait on its FAB progress, its the last crucial component to able to show the US the middle finger!!! JIA YOU

from CnTechPost

China has built 819,000 5G base stations, accounting for 70% world's total​

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

May 17, 2021
China has taken the lead in the development of

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, the next-generation communication technology, and has built a total of more than 819,000 5G base stations, accounting for about 70 percent of the world, China's Ministry of Industry and Information Technology (MIIT) recently said.
China has 280 million 5G cell phone end-user connections, accounting for more than 80 percent of the world's share, the MIIT said.
China's share of the world's 5G standard-essential patent declarations exceeds 38 percent, up nearly 5 percentage points since the first half of last year, ranking the first in the world.
Liu Honglie, Vice Minister of the MIIT, said China will continue to promote the rapid development of 5G, strengthening the development of international standards, and encouraging industry to participate in the standardization of 5G international specifications R17 and R18.
China will promote the development of 6G, carry out research on 6G application scenarios, and focus on promoting breakthroughs in key technology innovation, the MIIT said.

China will build on the foundation of 5G, combining technological evolution, economic and social development trends, and studying the future 6G vision needs and application scenarios, the MIIT said.

Click to expand...

Hey brother, I really not an expert on this stuff, I see it as business. But this is a technology business, which one has to understand a little bit about technology, and in this case of 5G, it is all about 1) networks, 2) range of the antenna.

I try to find an old article from the Financial Times for you tomorrow, which laid out a road map of where and how the 5G roll outs will happen worldwide. After the publication of that article, the fight started and all the disinformation associated with warfare started too.

Just my impression that everything is on schedule for the 5G roll out in China. The rest of the world, seems like a delay due to the pandemic.

ansy1968 said:

@horse bro I remember your post about 5g application and how Huawei even though its smartphone business had taken a hit will remain strong! well she had provided more than 60% of China total base station or 45% of the world total. With that leadership she is able to diversify leveraging its expertise defeating the purposes of the ban which is to destroy her. Now we had to wait on its FAB progress, its the last crucial component to able to show the US the middle finger!!! JIA YOU

Click to expand...

What the United States tried to do to Huawei was underhanded and cheating, because they had nothing left, there was no other options at that point.

Just my impression, was that the United States government did not want to kill Huawei exactly, but it did know what to do either. The point is they were going to lose the race to 5G unless they could stop Huawei from beating them.

Therefore the US strategy became they must stop Huawei with any means possible which included trying to kill it, and if they could not stop Huawei, they try to slow it down. A part of this strategy is trying to get more US allies to reject Huawei, because that will give the US and it allies a larger base, trying to replicate economies of scale in the 5G realm for their own advantage. If Huawei was killed that was best for them, but if it was ahead with America and allies just one step behind, that would be an acceptable outcome too.

The plan from the US government was extreme desperation. They try to sell it as strength (that is wartime propaganda don't fall for it), because in this fight, they brought nothing but lawyers and their legal injunctions or whatever you call it.

If Huawei had a better antenna, and better noise reduction meaning faster speeds in their cables, to fight this fight, you must have a better antenna or faster cables. But no, the Americans brought lawyers to the antenna fight and cable fight. Why bring a lawyer to a knife fight or gun fight? It never had a chance.

Once the Germans hesitated, in that they did not want to disclose what they wanted to do about Huawei, this war was over for all intent and purposes.

All that was left was to decide the new borders after the war.

But the Americans refused to give up, and were in complete shock, because they being the chosen people, they cannot lose.

That is how I see it, and that is why we have been subjected to over 2 years of bullshit from the media about Huawei.

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Last comment before bedtime, is that the chip war is a different war.

We can call it the tech war, with 5G as one theater and semiconductors as another theater. But the Huawei was is different from the SMIC war.

That is warfare. Once the war starts, it has a tendency to expand.

This tech war, this round at least, will probably conclude in the next 2 or 3 years. There could be a lot of collateral damage, so we got to watch the news for companies jumping ship to save themselves.

For example, if you were TSMC, what exactly will you do? Like the fuck they would know. They got a billion dollar business, and they got no clue about the future.

We see what plays out.

ansy1968 said:

@Tyler sorry bro, a novice but from what I understand a 5g base station needs a 14nm chip and below to be fully efficient. Before the SMIC sanction, I think they had supply Huawei a large batch of 14nm chips, hope @WTAN and @foofy can back me up. And if the news of Huawei FAB 20nm chip production next year for their bases station, maybe they may tweak some parts to make it efficient comparable to the 14nm performance.

Click to expand...

There is the concern that if they cannot buy or manufacture more efficient chips, then if these base stations need some repair or replacement, then they may not be able to do so. The durability and reliability are some potential issues.

Tyler said:

There is the concern that if they cannot buy or manufacture more efficient chips, then if these base stations need some repair or replacement, then they may not be able to do so. The durability and reliability are some potential issues.

Click to expand...

@Tyler bro no expert but the 20nm chips is a temporary solution until Huawei can produce its 14nm chips or the localized SMIC 14nm is available. So you're right maybe their bases station is modular and upgradeable.

horse said:

Therefore the US strategy became they must stop Huawei with any means possible which included trying to kill it, and if they could not stop Huawei, they try to slow it down. A part of this strategy is trying to get more US allies to reject Huawei, because that will give the US and it allies a larger base, trying to replicate economies of scale in the 5G realm for their own advantage. If Huawei was killed that was best for them, but if it was ahead with America and allies just one step behind, that would be an acceptable outcome too.

Click to expand...

Does it actually make any sense for the US to throw almost the kitchen sink just to thwart Huawei? It would seem no, but then consider that the Snowden revelations revealed the US government was forcing tech companies to embed backdoors into their IT products for spying against strategic competitors AND allies. Then consider that Huawei's prominence and its lack of American sponsored backdoors was already gradually breaking America's former stranglehold on the world's networks that they use for spying.

horse said:

Once the Germans hesitated, in that they did not want to disclose what they wanted to do about Huawei, this war was over for all intent and purposes.

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Fyi, Angela Merkel discovered during the Obama administration that they were spying on her. This American compromised equipment that allows the American government unfettered spying ability against everyone is interrupted wherever non-US allied countries equipment exists, such as from a Huawei or ZTE.

horse said:

This tech war, this round at least, will probably conclude in the next 2 or 3 years. There could be a lot of collateral damage, so we got to watch the news for companies jumping ship to save themselves.

Click to expand...

Considering what I have come to expect from American foreign policy makers, I highly doubt that. It's much more likely that after, or immediately before, China creates a fully domestic supply chain for >=14nm equipment that they will already move onto other avenues of sanctions. Keep in mind there was already talk of banning the sale of commercial turbofans, ARM, x86 and even evictions from associations like Bluetooth, WiFi, SD, etc. This kind of nutty talk already happened.

krautmeister said:

Does it actually make any sense for the US to throw almost the kitchen sink just to thwart Huawei? It would seem no, but then consider that the Snowden revelations revealed the US government was forcing tech companies to embed backdoors into their IT products for spying against strategic competitors AND allies. Then consider that Huawei's prominence and its lack of American sponsored backdoors was already gradually breaking America's former stranglehold on the world's networks that they use for spying.


Fyi, Angela Merkel discovered during the Obama administration that they were spying on her. This American compromised equipment that allows the American government unfettered spying ability against everyone is interrupted wherever non-US allied countries equipment exists, such as from a Huawei or ZTE.


Considering what I have come to expect from American foreign policy makers, I highly doubt that. It's much more likely that after, or immediately before, China creates a fully domestic supply chain for >=14nm equipment that they will already move onto other avenues of sanctions. Keep in mind there was already talk of banning the sale of commercial turbofans, ARM, x86 and even evictions from associations like Bluetooth, WiFi, SD, etc. This kind of nutty talk already happened.

Click to expand...

Next step for the US is total chip (not just IC equipment, but chips themselves) ban for < 14nm.